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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> top end shot
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Message started by Todd on 01/23/06 at 15:46:31

Title: top end shot
Post by Todd on 01/23/06 at 15:46:31

I locked my motor on my 96 Savage and am now at a point where I can afford to undergo a rebuild. I believe the valve dropped into the piston. Pretty Ugly. Was wondering if it is economically sound to try and rebuild the big single or if I would be better served trading it in on a new bike. I went to my local dealer to see if I would be able to buy a new motor if necessary, but was told that Suzuki does not sell motors alone. Of course I would get nothing on a trade in, but was graciously shown a new Boulevard 50C. Are there any suggestions to rebuilding the top end or is it possible to bore out the piston without inserting a new sleeve. Bigger task than I am wanting to undertake unless the financial gain is worth it.
Thanks for any helpful input.

Grace and Peace,
Rooster

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by torque on 01/23/06 at 15:55:09

well it does cost a pretty pennie to do a rebuild.
did u take the motor apart yet?on the savage u cant replace the sleeve,u have to buy the whole jug,which can be bored though,i think 2mm oversize is the biggest u can go.but until u know what parts u need it hard to tally up the cost. but my guestimate would be at least $600 probably more :P i know the same thing happened to jim-r and it cost him $1,700 at a dealer probably around $1,100 just for the parts.

good luck with it ;)

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by SAMM on 01/23/06 at 16:04:17

Where are you ?? If you decide to not repair it , someone here may be willing to give you more than the stealership will and it will give you more to put twards a new bike ???

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by Ed_L. on 01/23/06 at 16:24:20

It will depend if you punched a hole in the piston or not. If the valve went through the piston then you have metal all through the gears and lower end of the engine. If that's the case them cleaning out all that metal will be the problem when rebuilding. If the piston is intact then a rebore, oversized jug and complete head might get you by. If you sucked a valve then the head is probably shot also. Tracking down a used engine should be the cheep and easy way to get you bike running if that is your main concern. You need to pull the head off the motor and take a look inside first. Sounds terminal like the end of the line for the engine. Good Luck

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by Todd on 01/24/06 at 13:42:25

Yes, I figured I would be in the 600-1,000 dollar range on the rebuild. I do need to get inside and see the damage on the piston wall, I was just curious to know if I would need to replace the jug or get away with a bore job. I am hesitant at what change might occur to the performance if I were to go ahead with the bore.
It does appear terminal, but the bike is really a pretty nice machine cosmetically speaking and it would be hard to part it out.
I am located in Indiana for any iterested parties, I would also entertain offers that are not abusive nor offensive to my situation, I have already got that from the dealer.
Thanks!

Grace and Peace,
Rooster

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by Reelthing on 01/24/06 at 15:58:54

I see some fairly low mileage engines on ebay now and then go for $600-$700 - if the piston is blown to bit's it might worth watching awhile

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by orrin7 on 01/24/06 at 18:35:28

sorry for your problem. if you decide to part with the bike let me know. if you decide to rebuild it and need a hand with machine work or anything else let me know , i work in an engine shop and could help

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by Jim_R on 01/24/06 at 20:52:49

Can you believe that after spending all that money to rebuild the top cylinder head, when Torque changed my oil he found all kinds of metal in the oil filter. My god if you guys only saw how many shavings were in there.
I know the piston bent the valves but you think they would have cleaned it out. I just hope that nothing serious will happen.

I still think my bike is cursed haha. Suzuki curse hehe.

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by Reelthing on 01/25/06 at 03:59:53

get one of those magnetic drain plugs unless its all aluminum it should pull some of thrash out

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by bobtreat on 01/25/06 at 07:41:08

I just so happen to have a nice used cylinder and piston
All it needs is rings.If yours is beyond repair.I picked it up a couple years ago when i bought my savage new.I always say it's better to have an not need spare parts.
I'm cusious what let go in the head?

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by slavy on 01/25/06 at 07:48:15

Couple of thoughts.
1. Depending on the overall shape of the bike, decide does it worth rebuilding. You can get a "new" one in excellent condition for under $2000 and still have Yours like a spare.
2. If your bike is very nice again before You decide wich way to go- see what are the dammages.
If the head has to be replaced- You might be able to get a good complete head from eBay for about $250.
The thing is that if You seized the top end I don't know what did You do to the rest of the engine. Somebody that is good with diagnostics must take a good look at the motor and take a note of everything to be replaced. I'd suggest to replace the cam chain too. A lot of times the cam chain stretches and brakes, causing the piston to hit one of the valves, after that - bad head and bad piston.

Where are You located ?

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by lancer on 01/25/06 at 09:18:43

If you decide to rebuild I would be interested in some of the parts as well, expecially the cam, head, cylinder...even if there is some damage to them.

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by Todd on 01/25/06 at 11:10:46

I will have a buddy of mine help me tear into it maybe next week some time, it is to nice of a Savage to part out. I am confident that it can be brought back life, but it is scary to think about those pesky shavings.
Thanks for your input, I will keep you posted on the decision I make. Can't stand the thought of another bike payment, but the thought of not riding is even worse.
The offer for a new piston and other parts is very attractive to my wallet.
I am located around Lafayette for those of you wondering.
Once again thanks for the advice!

Grace and Peace
Rooster

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by SAMM on 01/25/06 at 12:18:55

I am wondering why you think it is siezed or a broken valve ?? What were you doing when it happened?? Could it be the inner starter gear bound up??

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by todd on 01/25/06 at 15:25:50

I was advancing through the gears during take off, not real hard, in fact I was surprised that something happened to the motor at such low revs. I would say I was maybe middle throttle when it let go.
The reason I am convinced that it was a valve is do to the damage on the ignition side of the spark plug. Scored quite a slice into the metal. As the top end let go, it was a immediate shut down, followed by some tapping falling through what sounded like the piston location. I had noticed some light tapping in the motor proceeding the shut down, maybe for about a week or so. I had actually been planning for a valve adjustment before all this happened, since I was at about 20,000 miles.
I am convinced of the seizure on the motor because I can not rotate the rear tire while in gear, I believe this is an idicator that the piston is rufusing to move.

Grace and Peace,
Rooster

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by torque on 01/25/06 at 15:28:36

yep it sounds like your cam chain broke,the tapping sound was the chain flopping around :(

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by SAMM on 01/25/06 at 15:41:32

Torque.. When you loose a T Chain will the piston hit the valves on a savage ???

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by torque on 01/25/06 at 15:53:06

yeah buddy, thats what happened to jim-r's bike

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by rokrover on 01/26/06 at 08:05:59

This is kinda scary and apparently not that unusual. So I guess you need to replace that chain every 20K or so? Can't remember if there's some recommendation in the manual. Auto timing chains seem to last well over 100K. I read somewhere a single stresses the chain more because of the uneven rotational pulses working on just two lobes, unlike a multicylinder engine where this gets evened out.

Title: Re: top end shot
Post by torque on 01/26/06 at 08:15:10

yeah i found out i needed a new cam chain when i took the side cover off too replace the clutch. the chain tensioner was about ready to fall out :o then when i took the valve cover off i saw i needed a new camshaft :P thats when i deceided to do a rebuild. about $400