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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> second gear /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1168679184 Message started by stinger on 01/13/07 at 01:06:24 |
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Title: second gear Post by stinger on 01/13/07 at 01:06:24 I think in 4 years I have started out from a dead stop on my savage in first gear maybe twice. I always use second gear. Its low enough it dosn't bog down on starts and it accerates much quicker. Is there some reason this isnt good for the tranny? I think I read somewhere in here long ago that it wasnt advised, but I cant remember why? Any help? Also I seem to use my brakes as much as anyone but I have just passed 26,000 miles on the original brake set. I bought it new in 02. The dealer said the front was ready for a change but the rear still had some wear. How can this be? I read where some in here have changed in as little as 9,000 miles. I dont do much city riding but still, isnt that a bit abnormal for this bike? |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by YonuhAdisi on 01/13/07 at 05:04:34 stinger wrote:
It is actually very common that the front brakes need replacing long before the rear. The front provides over three quarters of the over all stopping power and it is used most often. |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by john1652 on 01/13/07 at 07:03:13 stinger wrote:
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Title: Re: second gear Post by georgekathe on 01/13/07 at 11:37:48 think you will wear out clutch quicker if starting in 2nd the time as other entry said. I'm amazed about brakes - but I would replace them with EBC ones (I did my own but bought ex local bike store as not much dearer than online & like to put some business their way in case I ever need them). Your local place should have them or be able to get them. Think you will be amazed with new brakes - not just because EBC ones are better than oem ones but have trouble with not believing they are not worn after those miles (also little amazed dealer did not want to earn some $$ off you changing them!) |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by Rockin_John on 01/13/07 at 17:00:35 stinger wrote:
As other's have mentioned, you will wear the clutch faster by taking off in second gear. If you are "accelerating" much quicker, it must be due to slipping the clutch, because it is not possible for a higher geared machine to launch as quick as a lower geared machine unless the clutch is slipped A LOT. that is why drag bikes and cars have very low gearing for the launch. Here is how the transmission gearing stacks up between the Savage 4-speed (80s) models, and the 95 and on models: Ratio - 4-speed 5-speed ----------------------------------------------------- 1st gear 2.214 ----- 2.333 2nd gear 1.500 ----- 1.578 3rd gear 1.095 ----- 1.142 4th gear 0.875 ----- 0.956 5th gear __________0.884 Now here is my subjective opinion: I have the 4-speed model, and I WISH I had your slightly lower first gear for quick starts! Your second is slightly lower than mine, and maybe that is what makes you comfortable starting in it with your 5-speed. I would not subject my clutch to the slippage from starting in second gear on my 4-speed. I've stated before that the Savage has such a wide torque band that it only NEEDS 3-gears, and I believe that I could ride quite well with 3 wide ratio gears, but I'd want them to be like the low first in the 5-speed and a second gear somewher between the existing seconds and thirds (maybe 1.25?) for high gear, I'd want something higher than either existing transmission like a .75 (?) that would grunt along at 65mph at an RPM that would just allow accelleration for easy passing. (My ratio numbers are just guesses thrown out there as examples, I didn't "do the math.") OTOH, as someone else suggested, an ideal would be to have MORE gears. I think 6 in close ratio would be plenty. A serious low first for digging out. An "all she can handle" OD for sixth, and evenly spread gears between for general purpose. And you then you don't have to use them ALL. If you want to take off at a moderate rate; start in second. If you never go over 55; never use sixth. If you like to short-shift, just skip gears between as needed. As far as your brakes wearing slowly: The front does bear the brunt of the load if used properly. And if yours seem to be lasting longer than you think other people's, you must be using them easier than you think. For instance, though I ride my bikes hard, I drive my autos to the speed limits, but VERY smoothly on both accelleration and braking. My maintenence on the cars/trucks is probably far less than people who stomp the gas, tailgate, ride the brakes, and barely stop in time at red lights. As the man says YMMV ;D |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by justin_o_guy on 01/13/07 at 17:13:17 Ratio - 4-speed 5-speed ----------------------------------------------------- 1st gear 2.214 ----- 2.333 2nd gear 1.500 ----- 1.578 3rd gear 1.095 ----- 1.142 4th gear 0.875 ----- 0.956 5th gear __________0.884 Thanks for posting this. I have a basic question & will be exposing my ignorance & to the level it exists momentarily,, when something, I don't know what, turns 2.214 times in first gear, something else, again I don't know what, must turn once. Please, fill in the blanks,, |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by azjay on 01/14/07 at 06:47:29 transmission input shaft (engine) turns 2.214 times transmission output shaft (drive pulley) turns 1 time .956, .884, .875, represent overdrive gear ratios. |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by Rockin_John on 01/14/07 at 19:37:59 azjay wrote:
Just to make this more clear... The ratio is 'lower' when the higher number first is larger: 3.0:1 < 2.5:1 < 2.0:1 ... (lower to higher). But once past zero=(1:1) and into OD (overdrive) the last number being smaller makes ther gearing 'higher': 1:.95 > 1:9.0 > 1:.85 getting higher with each step... Clear as smoke huh? |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by justin_o_guy on 01/15/07 at 12:37:04 Yea, actually, not a prollum, Just had ni idea what was being measured. Once identified, it's easy. I've been a mechanic & body man & roughneck & fixed copiers & cash registers, so taking things apart & LEAVING them apart is no problem for me,, he he he,,Thanks for the rundown, |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by barry68v10 on 01/15/07 at 19:19:01 One thing you'll want to keep in mind when comparing the 4sp to the 5sp is different size pulleys. The 5sp has a larger pulley on the front and smaller on the rear which results in slightly higher (engine runs slower) overall gearing. |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by geo on 01/15/07 at 19:43:08 Wow, you start in second gear only? The problem is you will get more clutch wear. That's a major tear down issue for a motorcycle. I always blastoff in first gear up to 35mph. Second gear is still strong from there up to 55mph. Third gear will take you to 75mph strongly. Now, I wear out rear tires fairly fast, but this is a much easier repair than a clutch replacement. |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by Greg_650 on 01/15/07 at 21:37:04 stinger wrote:
Didn't you just take a long road trip? |
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Title: Re: second gear Post by justin_o_guy on 01/16/07 at 01:51:46 Stock front brake was shot at 5,000 miles. It was also wearing at a slope, so that took one edge down quickly. Oddly, it was the leading edge that wore down. Seems the rear edge would be the one to go first if it was gonna be uneven, since the rotor would tend to drag it into the rotor & spread at the front, closing tighter at the rear.Anyway, with almost 9,000 on the EBC front now on it, I thinko it's starting to stop better. That or I am turnin into POpeye.The rear brake, with the surface area seriously diminished, stops so much better I am tickled,, How long will it last? I dunno, but quality is so improved I really don't mind if it shortened the life of it. |
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Title: Re: second gearer Post by Rockin_John on 01/20/07 at 02:56:20 barry68v10 wrote:
Don't know where you got that information from, but according to the parts microfiche at Ron Ayers, every version all the way from the 1986 all the way to the 2005 model S-40 uses both the same front and rear pullies. |
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