SuzukiSavage.com - Print Page

SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl
General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Things every savage newb should know...
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1344399573

Message started by verslagen1 on 08/07/12 at 21:19:33

Title: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 08/07/12 at 21:19:33

435C5A5D40477646764E5C501B290 wrote:

If you need help with a mechanical problem... Ask your question in the Rubberside section...
We will need to know a bit about your bike, and you...
Year, Miles, modifications that apply to the problem.
Your mechanical experience, and let us know if English is not your first language...
Where you are located is helpful, too...
Also,...
What was done just before the bike started acting up, including filling up with gas.

Symptoms?
Ran fine for months, now it won't start, cuts out at speed, or what?

if its a clutch problem, what oil is in it?

06252D2F2C25252C3B490 wrote:

Four Things to do before you start to troubleshoot your bike's issues

We help a lot of new persons with a lot of issues every week. Repeatedly, we see them tripping over the same things, very simple things really. Things that YOU MUST DO before you even try to troubleshoot your bike.

1) Have a full fresh trickle charge (multimeter over 12.6 volts) on a known good battery. Not a battery tender, a no more than 2 amp normal bike style battery charger. Why? Tenders send right at 12.1 volts and your battery drops down to that amount overnight. Your tests are all based on a FULL fresh charge at 12.6 volts which takes 13+ volts from the charger (which is what you get from a normal 2 amp charger).

2) Have a fresh FULL tank of gasoline. I know, it only makes common sense -- but you would be amazed at the people killing themselves with 1/8 tank of last summer's very stale gas and they simply can't get the bike to start ..... 10% ethanol gasoline and its "age out" issues has only made this requirement more important, so drain your gas tank and refill if you think you have old or not enough gasoline in it.

3) Have basic metric tools. If your bike won't run you need to have a set of metric tools and a volt/ohm multimeter, minimum. If all you have is the tool kit that came with the bike, please say so up front.

4) You must read and understand the POSTING GUIDELINES at the top of Rubber Side Down. Rubber Side Down isn't the chat section -- that is over in Cafe. Next, to moderators , they are trying to help you get the best advise ........

1... Clymers has errors... Suzuki/Clymer Manual Errors (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1119775997)

2... Owners will sell a bike rather than do maitenance... Cam Chain Adjuster check (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1191167029)

3... Lot's of info in the tech section. The link is in my sig where the orange is pointing. Control F will help you find what you're looking for.

4... Don't ask about oil, not even where it goes. Especially not to bill.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Serowbot on 08/07/12 at 22:55:58

Quote:

Just a little note to noobies...
It may seem like some folks get more attention than others...
But,... keep in mind... We are only human...
If your problem is uncommon,.. it may take more time to find someone with experience or expertise...
You aren't being ignored... just set aside for a more expert answer...
No one here, wants to leave anyone out... ;)...

...and,... beware 3 things...
...the vacuum petcock sucks...
...and the cam-chain adjuster is a hand grenade...

... (and lift the front of the seat 1" to 2" inches)...

... all, fixable for less than $100.00...

Get a Raptor petcock, a Versy adjuster and a couple of rubber stoppers... and you'll own the best bike available in the last 30 years... ;)...

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Serowbot on 08/28/12 at 18:56:27

3072756471626D6E726473010 wrote:

Whats a Versy aduster?

;)...

http://www.savageriders.com/verslagen/CamChainClub/fixed.jpg (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1180206459)

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Oldfeller on 09/04/12 at 03:24:46

ZDDP amounts in your oil is important to our Savage engine
(most modern bike oils do not have enough).

We have to bump our oils with ZDDP booster to get up to the right amounts.

Recommended oils listing: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1344471565

Booster blend table: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1345080430

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Oldfeller on 10/24/12 at 21:35:04

Your bike must idle at at least 1,000 rpm in order to provide enough oil flow and pressure to your aluminum cam journal bearings up in your head.

That super-kool sounding super low lump....lump....lump....lump....lump Harley style idle speed can and will do harm to your engine.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 10/29/12 at 15:35:28

Signatures are at the bottom of the posts, mine has an orange pointing to a line of text, which is a link to the Tech Section Index.

To save time, you can list your bike info and mods in your signature so when you ask a question, everyone knows what your bike is.

You can also list your location (city, state or country) in your CPanel info

This helps a lot with knowing some basic issues and language difficulties.

And when a mad deranged lunatic is apprehended there, we know why you're not talking to us anymore. ;D

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 11/03/12 at 11:03:19

0123342B0F2B2927420 wrote:

By the way, the reason that magnet broke free like that is because the glue holding it in place melted from the starter over-heating.

If you're having a hard time getting your bike to start - don't sit there with the starter button pressed and the motor spinning for minutes on end.

Starters are only designed to be run for about 15 seconds before they need a 5 minute cool-down period. Obviously they can handle a little more abuse than that but if you managed to melt that glue - you went way over that.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Boofer on 01/27/13 at 19:46:05

PAY ATTENTION! (Not shouting--just for emphasis). Had a great small dealer and good staff until it burned, but even with an S40 on the floor the first couple of times Jason tried to give me a spin-on oil filter. Always make sure they understand LS650P (In my case). The SV650 is apparently very popular and looked up often. OK if you know your parts, but not okay if you order parts and wait for a week and tear it down and... :'(

OF I agree with Boofer, dealerships don't deal with the Savage often enough to build any real skills with it.

Their parts departments need to be watched like a hawk and their service departments are notorious for giving the bike to the young pre-college dude who works on the little dirt bike singles to fix it "since it is just a big single".

Not so, it is analogous to the old brit bike racing singles more so than a dirt bike -- but none of them know that. Every spring we get told new horror stories about newbie folks paying hundreds of dollars for a dealership "Mikey" to totally screw up their bikes.

V1 +japanese to english lacking much description.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Digger on 03/03/13 at 19:34:45

If your bike won't start, but the starter motor is cranking your engine, the first thing to suspect should be your battery.

On these bikes, it is possible for the battery to have enough power to enable the starter motor to crank the engine, but to not have the additional power that it takes to create a spark at the spark plug.

Result: An engine that cranks without starting.

If you suspect that this is causing your no start condition, recharge the battery. If you still aren't having any luck, and still suspect the battery, get said battery load tested.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 03/28/13 at 21:32:14

This bears repeatin'...

417A77747641667D7D76612220130 wrote:

NO ONE KNOWS MORE ABOUT THE LS650 THAN THE MEMBERS ON THIS FORUM.
WE ARE THE ONES WHO FIND THE REAL PROBLEMS & COME UP WITH FIXES THAT WORK.
THE DEALERS DON'T WORK ON ENOUGH OF THESE TO BE FAMILIAR WITH THEIR PARTICULAR ISSUES.

BOTTM LINE: ALWAYS COME HERE FIRST!!! THEN IF YOU HAVE TO USE A DEALER, YOU WILL BE BETTER INFORMED THAN HE IS!

DON'T TRUST DEALERSHIPS TO KNOW HOW TO REPAIR THIS BIKE, THEY DON'T!!!!!

AND YES, I'M SHOUTING BECAUSE EVERYONE WITH AN LS650 NEEDS TO HEAR IT!!!! THIS HAPPENS TOO MANY TIMES & WE USUALLY ONLY HEAR ABOUT AFTER THE DEALER HAS GOT YOUR MONEY FOR SOMETHING YOU DIDN'T NEED!!!!!! 8-)

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/19/13 at 09:19:05

Or they put the oil filter on bakkerds & ruined the motor..
How many times have we seen that? IM Thinkin 3..

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 02/07/14 at 13:53:24

Before you go off and do a "I D 10 T" error...

this is a link for your convenience...

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1181745927

This is also a link...

Table of Contents with links (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1181745927)

Some people call it an Easter egg cause it's disguised.

Title: Re: - RE:: Things every savage newb should...
Post by Dave on 11/01/15 at 02:40:46

2B0119150701600 wrote:

Does it not matter that the Rottela triple T, containing the needed ZDDP, is made for Diesel engines? I just bought Savage and followed recommendations here, but, I fear I may not have fully understood. I just put Rotella triple T non synthetic in my new bike and am just looking for reassurance here.

Rotella T is a HDEO....Heavy Duty Engine Oil. It comes in 15W-40 weight, which we all associate with Diesel Engines, and it is a great oil for use in a diesel....but it also is a great oil for use in 4 cycle gasoline engines.

Trust us on this one.......those of us who use it are not tearing our bikes apart to fix worn cams and rockers.
;)

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Art Webb on 11/02/15 at 09:42:10

02393423323E252338303D22510 wrote:

[quote author=293A3C3F2D2A2A480 link=1344399573/15#17 date=1446397649]Also, if you search a bit you'll find the certifications on the back of the bottle, including JASO (japanese moto certification) Rotella is as 'appropriate' for your Savage / S40 as Suzuki Motorcycle oil

JASO - Japanese Automotive Standards Organization[/quote]
clarification: JASO MA/MA2 (motorcycle)

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 11/04/15 at 14:12:45

We keep rehashing this...

526C677A777A77150 wrote:

To me these words mean the crankshaft won't rotate:
-- it won't crank
-- it won't kick over
-- it won't turn over

To me these words mean the battery and the starter will make the crankshaft rotate but the motor won't start up and commence to idle:
-- it'll crank but not start
-- it'll turn over but not fire
-- it'll spin around but it won't run
-- when I let go of the key, it stops making that starting noise and nothing happens

I can decode the meaning of those terms okay.

What riles me is when someone just says, it won't crank. Down here you have a 3 out 4 chance of that meaning it spins over with the starter, but it won't start running. Maybe that's what "it won't kick over" means, I dunno.

If I am trying to help someone with that level of vocabulary, I usually start asking some really simple questions, so we have a meeting of the minds as to what info is being imparted.,...
-- When you touch the starter button, does it make any noise?
-- What kind of noise does it make,.. does it just make a clicking sound like a wall switch and then stay quiet?,,...or does it make a whirring sound that stops when you let go of the key?
-- so on and so forth

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/12/15 at 21:53:26

It's a challenge. People who are in a bind and frustrated and maybe even a little scared sometimes seem to expect others to just Know what they hear and feel and see.
Help! Won't kick over!

I don't know if it cranks, won't start, or, won't crank at all.

I'll bet a dollar if I was there I could kick it over...

Help, Won't crank..

I don't know if it turns over.

Help, starter motor is not making the engine turn over.

Now I need to know about the sounds.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Beggaa on 01/22/18 at 05:46:53

What's a Raptor petcock?

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Dave on 01/22/18 at 06:28:05

0D2A28282E2E4F0 wrote:

What's a Raptor petcock?

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1366651397

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Matchless G11 on 02/23/18 at 15:03:10

What about the starter toque limiter upgrade for the pre 96 bikes. That might be a newb thing to know?

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Eegore on 03/30/18 at 07:11:31

What about the starter toque limiter upgrade for the pre 96 bikes. That might be a newb thing to know?

I didn't know there was an upgrade for this.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Transp0rt3r on 04/26/18 at 11:33:25

quick and may be a dumb question, guys ;D

What is the spark plug socket for this bike? None of my sp sockets fit over the plug :( 5/8 or 16mm seems to be small, anything bigger won't clear cooling fins :o

Thank you

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 04/26/18 at 14:38:13

08262D003122302B430 wrote:

Spark Plug Wrench

If you do not have the factory tool kit with the spark plug wrench included you will need to find an 18mm Spark Plug Wrench.

Sears has them in stock.

Kenny G

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Transp0rt3r on 04/27/18 at 09:01:51

Thank you!

tool kit had most of the wrenches missing, but found rusty screwdriver ::) Got 18mm MasterCraft spark socket at local store - $10!

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by batman on 05/18/18 at 12:01:41

Newbies have a need to read! At the top left hand side of the page there is page numbers that look like 123... 894 -( or current it changes) clicking on one of the periods between the numbers brings up a page numbers , with all that has ever been said by members from day one, by looking and reading backward through them you will learn more about your bike than an old guy like me can remember ! Reading a few pages at a time will give you a firm grasp of what this bike is about and give you knowledge to attempt repairs without doing further damage to your bike.(knowledge is power)

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by irritatedmongo on 10/19/19 at 02:56:19

"2) Have a fresh FULL tank of gasoline. I know, it only makes common sense -- but you would be amazed at the people killing themselves with 1/8 tank of last summer's very stale gas and they simply can't get the bike to start ..... 10% ethanol gasoline and its "age out" issues has only made this requirement more important, so drain your gas tank and refill if you think you have old or not enough gasoline in it."

I live in an area with steep hills. And my driveway slopes. I generally keep no less than a gallon in the tank. I found that if the fuel gets too low it seems like it may "unport" when the ground isn't level. I had a hard time keeping her running one time. Luckily she ran fine with the fuel valve set to RES. But now I keep a little more gas in the tank to help account for sloping terrain.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 10/19/19 at 08:37:08

2C37372C3124312021282A2B222A450 wrote:

I live in an area with steep hills. And my driveway slopes. I generally keep no less than a gallon in the tank. I found that if the fuel gets too low it seems like it may "unport" when the ground isn't level. I had a hard time keeping her running one time. Luckily she ran fine with the fuel valve set to RES. But now I keep a little more gas in the tank to help account for sloping terrain.

If it won't run right w/o a full tank or you need to run on RES on the last half (here's your sign) your petcock is ageing out, you need a raptor petcock.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Zepp on 04/18/20 at 08:46:03

Lesson learned.. I did have my Savage in the garage the whole winter, its a tempered garage and I have a humidcer in there. In anyway, I did take it out on Easter to start it up, it take some time to remember to turn the key in the right position, take the footstand of, and put all the buttons in the right position! After that, it started as new when I have put the choke out!
In anyway, it didnt idle that well, that I was use to. And then I talked to my biker friends about it, and the asked if I drenaged my carburator over winter? No I didnt done that, next question if I put som petrol stabilition to the gas tank befor I stored my bike.. no I didnt.
In anyway, It seems that Im done all the faults as a newbie? :'(
But they altso did get my some advice, put Alkylat petrol and/or petrol stabilitation befor one put the bike to rest in the garage next year!
Okey, I have to remeber this in autum.
In any case I bout some gallons of Alkylat petrol and a bottle of STP Fuel System Cleaner and take my bike for a ride, now its idle more smothly!
At least.. it was a super duper ride to day, 10 centigrades and a lot of sun! In anyway if some think that I got the wrong ideas or wrong advice, dont hesitate to answer, becus im in love in my Savage, and I want it to be an ever lasting love! :-*

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by 1geo1 on 07/26/20 at 16:30:43

I am new so if I get this wrong, forgive me, thanks :)
That being said I found something out I almost could not believe.
I rebuilt, jetted my carb ( I figure I repaired cars for 40 years, how hard could it be ? whole different post there, but anyways ) I went ti fire her up and crank/ no start ( yes, crankshaft turning ;) ) .
Check spark, OK, check compression ( with a gauge ) great.
WTF, lots of thought and figured the gas does not smell bad so wth ?
Light bulb, problems with my tractor, same gas.
PUT THE BEST FUEL YOU CAN BUY AT THE PUMP IN.
OK, I don't mean go and buy aviation gas, and maybe I went to far with my upgrades, but I did learn a lesson.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Zepp on 08/08/20 at 08:43:40

7E282A207E4F0 wrote:

Tell us more.. (or me at last) you seems to be experianced enough to do what you did! I dont do a thing, im to old and lasy. But I read a lot on this forum, there seems to be a vacum petcock kind of thing altso?

Sooo, Im just thinkering.. new petrol is almoste E10, it have a shelftime about some weeks/months (I think?), that could be a problem. Another problem on northern latitudes is if one store the bike for several months.. whit E10 fuel in the tank and carburator, it gonna evaporate in the carburator and leave som slime there.. mayby some aluminium corrotion to that?
In any case, my bike started up on spring the first pusch on the button after I rememeberd to get all buttons in the right place, choke out and the side stand to its up positions.
In any case I got a blue/yellow exhauste system.. it seems to me as a to lean mixture.. some dirt/slime in the carburator?
And top of this, im crying about that Suzuki dont gonna produce S40 anymore!

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 08/25/20 at 14:15:37

Something often overlooked will be soon be missing. :o

The tail end of the savage vibrates like hell, low frequency, large displacement. 8-)

License plates are made of crap and will crack and fall off if not reinforced.
sometime license plate trim is enough, but usually those are crap too.
can't go wrong with a backup plate.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/25/20 at 16:56:46

Have someone follow you away from a stop.
My daughter was wringing the Savage out, I was following on the guzzi,, She hit second and nailed it,, The plate was zinging left and right so hard there was no way to read it,

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by KLM on 05/05/21 at 14:45:31

As a Savage newb myself I thought it might be helpful to note that:

The Phillips screws on this bike aren't really Phillips but JIS.

Something I learned after stripping most of the carb screws on my 93 Yamaha Seca II

I picked up this guy: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00E55DL4I/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Worked really well on my 86 Savage carb and other screws.

To the mod's. Hope it's ok I added this as a newb myself. I did some searching and only found JIS mentioned in one thread.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Michael Moore on 05/07/24 at 10:58:05

I've just purchased a 1997 LS650. I'm sure other people besides me would be interested to know what the consensus is on engine gaskets: should I stick with OEM or are there reputable aftermarket brands at better prices?

I've had the experience with other bikes of buying aftermarket/pattern gaskets that were pretty useless, either a poor fit or poor material. But the OEMs usually buy-in things like gaskets and it is quite possible that an aftermarket gasket might be made by an OEM supplier.

I'm going to need side cover gaskets ASAP so I figured I should ask (since the forum search wasn't giving me an answer) before I order a supply that is either more expensive than needed or of lower quality than I'd like.

thanks,
Michael

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by verslagen1 on 05/07/24 at 12:49:19

I've purchased many different gaskets both OEM and others like Athena.
And I've read tales of varied results regarding fit but I usually have good results.

But, you can never go wrong with OEM gaskets.

It's just can you deal with small inconveniences for huge savings?

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by ThumperPaul on 05/07/24 at 13:11:38

I had a bad experience with a cheap alternator side crankcase gasket. I ended up replacing it with an OEM gasket. So it cost me more in the long run because I wasted money on the cheap gasket and having to do it twice (time investment).

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Michael Moore on 05/07/24 at 13:23:59

Thanks, there are some major aftermarket gaskets (Athena, Vesrah) that seem to be reliable over the years. I suppose that sticking with the "name brands", presuming they actually make what is needed, is probably pretty safe. But after reading the threads about the various counterfeit Keihin/Mikuni carbs and the woes people have had it is clear that caveat emptor is still a good practice.

As my wife remarked just now "how much do you save over the Suzuki gasket?" and that seemed a good point. :) But I can remember several years ago needing to buy a complete gasket/seal set for an SV650 and I think the kit from Suzuki set me back the better part of $200. I just checked at SuzukiPartsHouse and see GASKET SET 11400-24858,Your Price: $151.64. That's about 17 items including some 10 o-rings from $3-8 and a $24 clutch cover gasket. O-rings shouldn't be that expensive, but then there's the hope that Suzuki has included all that are needed and made sure they were the correct items too. Sometimes, the "budget" options aren't so good about that.

FWIW, there's a $30-40 variance in price on the OEM gasket sets depending on the vendor, so it pays to shop around a bit. That $151 is pretty much the lowest I saw.

Cometic lists some gaskets for the DR650, but none for the LS/S40. A friend found that Cometic was willing to make gaskets for his vintage race bikes if he sent them a DXF CAD drawing, and things like cover gaskets could often be reused several times if some care was taken. I'm going to ~~think about~~ order~~ing~~ the full set from Suzuki to start, and whatever doesn't get used goes into the spares box. I can scan and draw/reverse engineer them and have that as an option if they start to get hard to find.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by ThumperPaul on 05/07/24 at 14:56:53

I was going to say, you probably won’t find a consensus here. Too many different opinions. But there is probably a pretty strong bias for OEM when it comes to engine fasteners, gaskets, o-rings, and other less expensive engine parts.

A few things I’ve gambled on in the aftermarket parts world that have panned out include: stator $50 compared to $400+ new, starter relay $10 compared to $200+, knock-off Keihin carb $36 compared to $300+ genuine and over $600 for the stock OEM Mikuni CV carb, stock turn signals are $120 EACH and you can buy as low as about $15 for a set of 4 that work (I didn’t cheap out that bad and found a good pair of rear signals with the correct mounting setup for $40). There’s other stuff too that I bought that I wouldn’t pay OEM prices.

The cheap aftermarket gasket I bought was a good lesson/reminder to be careful where I want to cheap out. Your wife asked the right question.

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by Michael Moore on 05/08/24 at 08:52:07

I saw DragBikeMike mention a safety tip that I hadn't seen before, and it seems a good addition to the info for newbies thread:

"First things first. Disconnect your negative battery cable. The Savage has a mysterious habit of going into auto-start mode with absolutely no warning. It has something to do with the decompression relay. It's always a good practice to disconnect the battery before you start working on your motorcycle, but on the Savage it's imperative."

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by THESAVAGE on 12/10/24 at 14:09:47

thanks for all the info!

Title: Re: Things every savage newb should know...
Post by blod on 12/10/24 at 15:38:28

Can anyone tell me the best way to block off the carb vacuum plug, I have a Yamaha fuel switch coming but need to know the best way to block it.
Thanks