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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Adam Lanza /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1361286666 Message started by Jerry Eichenberger on 02/19/13 at 07:11:06 |
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Title: Adam Lanza Post by Jerry Eichenberger on 02/19/13 at 07:11:06 Gotta rush this morning, so please excuse the brevity. There is a story on Yahoo this morning about Adam Lanza, and photos of him. If what the story says is true, this kid should have been either in a mental institution or very closely watched for the past few years. He also owned thousands of dollars worth of violent video games which he played all day long- guess who is responsibile for that? |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 02/19/13 at 07:42:57 7778747E7578737F786F7A786F1D0 wrote:
Yes we know that ... as was the arizona shooter who shot gaby giffords ... But mental institution = screams about big government take over and tax $$$ on government take over of our mind screams from the Tea baggers. Video games - maybe they were an outlet for some people's violent behaviours ... or not, we dont know. Mommy's guns and bullets were not locked up. This is all that can be prevented free ... if she paid $100 a pop, she'd have I dunno 3 bullets and lock em all up. Unless you want to plonk down several trillion and not rail against govt spending like a tea bagger ... this is the only solution that will work. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Jerry Eichenberger on 02/19/13 at 08:12:52 Srinath - Again, goptta run for a trip, so excuse brevity. Yes, the costs of runing modern mental institutions is very high. One thing that never works, but it's a shame that it doesn't, is that parents and other family members need to be realistic about persons in their families who are mentally ill, don't be in denial, don't think you can make them normal yourself, and don't have dangerous things around. This guy killed his mother first, and probably would have done that with a kitchen butcher knife - I know, that isn't the same as 20 kids, but even leaving him access to something like a butcher knife is nuts when you have a bozo like this kid in your midst. First and foremost we have to recognize and deal appropriately with the mentally ill - I've heard your arguments about the cost of ammo, but he could have even strangled the mother with a short rope, as he killed her in her sleep. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Serowbot on 02/19/13 at 08:57:22 Nobody claims that gun control will prevent murder... ...but, it is possible that it would reduce the severity of these massacres... PBS Frontline, tonight, investigates Lanza's life... Should be interesting... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Paraquat on 02/19/13 at 09:19:48 There is no evidence that states she did not secure her firearms. --Steve |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/19/13 at 09:41:17 Pretty apparent she did not secure them if her mentally ill kid got ahold of em!!!! .. Whats wrong with people? Thinking that a firearm is a tool for helping the mentally ill?? Handing a gun to people with PTSD, autism, bi-polar?? Just dumb... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Paraquat on 02/19/13 at 11:12:22 We know he killed her. Did he then pick her pocket for the key to the vault? Or a key to a cable lock? Were the guns secured in a safe? Did he force entry into the safe? Were there even cable locks? If so did he cut the cables off? Drill out the locks? I highly doubt she forced a firearm into her son's hands and said "Ok, now kill me and go on a rampage." --Steve |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/19/13 at 11:14:32 & what kind of psych drugs had he been on? You know, the ones that that says on the papers in the package May tend to cause suicidal or homicidal ideations YOu know how many of these train wreck peo0ple are on those drugs? |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 02/19/13 at 18:48:29 A kitchen knife murder is messy ... killing a person and getting into a car and driving 5 miles to a school ... you're gonna be spotted @ the door ... hey who's that clown covered in blood ... someone call the cops, while I take a video with my cellphone and post to facebook. Now he killed his momma with her gun ... there fore its definitely "guns not secured" No one is stopping the near 5000 gun related deaths that will occour in 2013 (stats that have been blocked by the NRA BTW, how many accidents, how many murders, how many suicides, how many mass killings by lunatic etc etc) $100 bullet tax will get that 5k to say 1000 .... 1500. You remember the phrase "he's not worth it" truly, will mean something. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Trippah on 02/19/13 at 19:48:26 While we all would like some real information in our stats, I doubt that we'll ever really see it. and not becase of some evil empire plot. Many suicides, i believe, are reported as accidents so family members wont loose out on the life insurance. Many accidents were realy murders where someone has been brutilzing a family member etc and finally got his payback...few small town police have the heart to send a family rape victem or beaten child/wife to prison for finally getting back or getting free. No, while the Truth Is Out There, I suspect thats where it;ll remain. and if you add in all the strong feelings about guns, well..... ;) |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/19/13 at 22:34:05 Bullet tax? That is about as stupid as the cigarette tax, people are still smoking.. Then the only people shooting will be rich folk, or people will stash ammo stockpiles before the tax goes into effect? Some have already done exactly that.. If your gun winds up in the hands of someone who kills you, your gun is NOT SECURE PERIOD! These are case's of mentally ill people getting their hands on a weapon, it isn't rocket science. Colorado is putting out laws that govern ALL arm sales, even private, expanded background checks to include mental health. It should be interesting to see how they plan to enforce.. ONE gun shop in C/S Colo, sold over 750 guns since the government started to push gun laws, over 7000 background checks pending right now.. Its called fear peddling, its what the NRA does best.. I have owned guns my whole life, they are nothing more than a tool. Some people treat them like a status symbol, some people have to own every type of weapon they can afford. My guns stay in my locked safe, my pistol comes out at night and is within easy reach, it goes back in the safe in the morning, then into my waistband during my morning dog walk, then back into the safe.. I fire it once every month in practice, I fire one of my rifles in practice in that same period, then they are cleaned and oiled, go back into the safe. I once had my safe malfunction during a carpet instalation, it took me eight hours to get into it, which included laying the safe on its top and balancing it while I went in through a floor panel.. And its a cheap safe! I can't see a autistic kid doing what myself and my son in law had to do, and if the safe was still bolted to the floor like mine usually was (Carpet install had me move it out of closet), even worse.. I'll be perfectly honest, pro-gun people (NRA) piss me off just as bad as Anti-gun people! Its liking to a kid caught with their hands in the cookie jar, then bitching because they can't get enough cookies in their pockets. Then the anti-gun people live in their own little world, they have never owned a weapon, and would crap their draws if they ever had to defend themselves, or put grocerys on the table without a store clerk... I have no use for either! Both sides are making up statistics, both sides are puffed up, both are part of the problem, not the solution! |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Paraquat on 02/20/13 at 06:10:43 Magpul is... was... located in Colorado. In a letter they submitted to the Denver Press (I believe it was) they said if CO passes a magazine ban they are pulling out their 600 employees and estimated 85 million in tax revenue. Magpul has a government cage code. They produce for whole nations of militaries. http://www.bayoushooter.com/forums/showthread.php?51300-U.K.-orders-Magpul-EMAGs Whatever ban it was, passed. They said they are now moving to Nevada. The Suarez Group is offering sales of 30 round mags to Colorado residents only so they can buy them up before the ban goes into effect. --Steve |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/20/13 at 07:20:37 5D6C7F6C7C786C790D0 wrote:
Yes, they are making a statement, kinda stupid really.. You can no longer sell ONE of your products in the state of manufacter, so you move your whole operation? All I can say is adios... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/20/13 at 09:00:50 Thats a little thing called Principle at work there. Yep, theyre making a product, paying INto the State coffers. The state SOO appreciates it & So Strongly supports the 2nd amendment that they made a law that cost them $$$ & INjured the 2nd amendment. So, they said BYE! & I applaud them |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Paraquat on 02/20/13 at 09:20:34 I equally applaud their efforts. One of their big selling points is that they are designed and made in the USA. http://https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/307470_562514543760899_1969960137_n.jpg I'm playing by the rules. If you're going to change the rules halfway through the game I'm taking my ball and going home. http://https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/525731_562190437126643_428090081_n.jpg --Steve |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/20/13 at 10:29:01 Again, The new laws will not FORCE them to move, they are choosing to move, to make a political statement.. Maybe we should let the CEO go cleanup the next mess his product has a hand in... Irresponsible gun owners damaged the second amendment... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/20/13 at 11:49:23 " Forced" isnt Just physically, arm twisted "Forced". Forced is also applicable to this situation. It is part of living ones life & acting on Principle. Not something the left is commonly acquainted with. The left sees no REal TRuth, everything is relative. There is no REal Right & Wrong. I see things differently. YOu think the CEO of a car manufacturer should go clean up after a drunk slams one of "His" cars into someone? Your concept of justice is odd.. The state made a statement. They also showed how they feel & as we've seen in years gone by, that step was just the first step. Why should anyone believe that would be the only thing they banned? I applaud them, Loudly |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 02/20/13 at 18:23:02 The left this the left that ... dude gun manufacturers have protections against stuff like dead brakes or other BS. Cars have licenses, insurance, registrations, inspections and a whole slew of other crap ... all of which need to be put onto a gun. Stuff like Have license have insurance and everything else for the gun you are buying bullets for OK then you can buy bullets ... no license = no bullets ... Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/21/13 at 06:53:04 That was one of the most disjointed replies youve ever made. You didnt defend your position, you made it harder to grasp. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 02/21/13 at 19:32:24 584741465B5C6D5D6D55474B00320 wrote:
Gun manufacturers cant be sued, no matter what ... Say you glock leg - look it up - there is such a thing called glock leg, and you dont "get glock leg" you glock leg - I think the official term is "You glock leg yourself", and you cant sue them. You dont want to grasp it, cos it runs counter to your ethos ... Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/21/13 at 20:41:49 Here the FACT of the matter, a car manufacter does not make a product designed to kill.. Magpul does... Principle is fine, so is a bad business decision, you want to move an operation, the bottom line should mean more than princible.. A smart business man would be making 15 round clips to satisfy a customer base and the law, for the home state, not moving a business... They still can sell their large capacity mags to the military.. Just a dumb move.. I personally do not see the sense in weapon mag/clip limits, or for that matter any gun ban, but then I am not in charge, I don't make the laws, I am but a responsible gun owner paying the price for the owners who are not... I have seen this scenario many times.. Went to work for a major oil company who gave their employee free gas, until somebody decided to fill up all his neighbors cars. Had a boss once who let his employees charge a tab at any bar on Xmas party night, until somebody decided to buy the bar drinks also... The list is long, but these violations of responsibility of the second amendment has taken LIVES! And make no mistake the second amendment carrys a heavy responsibility with the right to bear arms! |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Serowbot on 02/21/13 at 21:19:43 61564741565257330 wrote:
Would you rather drive a Ford Pinto,... with 10 gallon tank,.. or a 100 gallon tank?... Better yet,.. which would you prefer, every other idiot on the road drive?.. assuming that you will be driving on those same roads with them?... ... or,.. if a gas line were going to explode on your block... would you rather it be a 1" line,.. or a 20" line?... Now,.. if a mentally deranged nut, was going to go postal at the mall where you and your family are shopping,... would you prefer he have a pair of 6 shooters,... or an AR-15,.. with a couple of 100 round mags?... Not every gas line is going to break,.. not every Pinto blows up,.. not every gun owner goes nuts... ... but,.. if the one next to you does... then, quantity becomes a paramount concern... :-?... ...so many examples... Would you rather your boat sink,.. one mile out or ten?... ... if your ceiling fell in,... better a one story, or a ten?... Less,... is better.... When the sh!t hits the fan,... I vote for less sh!t...;D... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/21/13 at 21:37:41 ONE life, ONE bullet, it doesn't matter how many rounds a gun carrys, a trained person with a single shot .22 can kill a lot of people before being stopped.. Thats a stupid analogy, the goal should be to not let a mentally deranged person get their hands on ANY weapon, not limit the amount of shells he has AFTER the fact! My personal feelings are that if a person wants to own a 105 Howitzer, fine, as long as that person is responsible, sane, and knows how to operate it.. The one thing that ALL the mass killers had in common in the last ten years, they were mentally ill, they did not ALL have AR-15's with 30 round mags, or AK's with 60 round mags, some did their killing with shotguns, some with pistols.. A guy nearby here just killed his kids and himself with a knife, another killed his wife with a knife.. The weapon holds no importance, it is but a tool, a deadly tool to be sure, but I can put a AR in my safe and it will sit there forever unless I pick it up, I am the deciding factor, NOT the gun... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 02/22/13 at 04:56:43 OK and who will determine who is sane ... and who now looks sane but will go nuts in a few weeks ? We blame the person ... but we dont check tem, we dont have funds for that. So every nut has full on access to guns as long as they have not committed a crime before ... except in a few sates like SC. And better yet, your gun will sit in your unlocked safe, till someone breaks in when they know you're out and steals it ... A $100 bullet will make sure they cant load it up en masse, and you will make sure its locked up or not have as many sitting around. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Paraquat on 02/22/13 at 06:14:20 5D5C47404F5A462E0 wrote:
What's the prerequisite for sanity then? Let's create a system for mental health checks. Who creates the system? Who judges? Who watches the watchers? This guy didn't need a high capacity magazine: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Whitman --Steve |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/22/13 at 07:30:58 According to the new Colorado background check law they are pushing through the house, anyone with a history of mental illness, private gun sales are going to require checks also.. I like the idea, I have nothing to hide.. I pity the darn fool who breaks into my house, first they would have to go through my Bosco alarm system, he alarms at the sound of a cat on the porch, let alone someone breaking down a door.. Then they will have to go through me, we never go anywhere, and I am always within arms length from a 9mm.. Then they would have to try to break into the safe, which is bolted to the floor, and took myself and my stepson eight hours to go in through the bottom.. It wouldn't be worth their efforts, cause even if they did get in, they wouldn't have the ammo, which is hidden other place, locked up.. And just before the so called $100 bullet law goe into effect? Yea, people buy 45,000 rounds for their private arsenals... Like I say, it will only limit bullets for the poor, so you'll have rich shooters.. Ammo is not cheap now, many people do their own reloading, there is always a way to get cheap stuff, cross into Mexico... Know a guy who ordered two 4500 round boxes of AK ammo from Poland, cost him $200... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by bill67 on 02/22/13 at 08:46:05 Does anyone have and idea when our government is going to come and take our weapons away from us. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/22/13 at 09:28:32 The answer to this is never... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 02/23/13 at 15:18:33 5B6C7D7B6C686D090 wrote:
Yea usually rich people dont go nuts and shoot up a school. Usually rich people are smarter about their $$ (sorry rap stars are exempt from this though). People buy 45,000 rounds cos it costs 10c per. If it cost $100 they'd buy what they need. Self defense bullets are reimbursed when cops show up to remove the dead guy. You'd buy bullets, but get them back after you have killed the intruder if you didn't shoot the cable guy. I've posted all this before. A $100 bullet tax that you pay for with cash - not credit card, cash will seriously clamp down on the mass killings, the drive-by's the random shootings ... and affect the self defense shootings very little. Better yet, it will clamp down on the loose bullets in private arsenals ... for $100 a pop you'd lock up our stash wont you. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 02/23/13 at 15:25:23 02090C0C5657600 wrote:
See they are now funding a study ... the same study that the NRA killed 12 years ago. Then after it takes 3-4 years to do there will ne a "findings report". That will then sit on a shelf while there is gridlock in congress before the 2016 elections. Of course after that if republicons take the WH, it will get shredded. If its democrat, then it will continue to gather dust unless all of congress is democratic. Then it would get approved ... but not before the gun nuts have stocked up for the next 1000 years and the gun companies have made trillions. Remember this is a campaign to sell guns. So it will be bolting the barndoor after the horse has bolted. After that they can easily claim he gun control didn't work ... Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/28/13 at 18:22:41 Just go to Chicago, or anywhere gun control is used as "The Answer". Why not try my idea? IF, as you say, crime will go where gun control is, then remove it. If crime doesnt drop, then it doesnt. If it goes up, then you may have a POINT that gun control helps control crime, butr I doubt that it will. Either way, the 2nd was put there for the people to have some means to protect themselves from a tyrannical government, SOoooo Its only needed in that respect when they try to end it. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 02/28/13 at 21:14:50 No the second amendment was put in place to protect OUR government from outside forces, hence the word militia... Many of the founding fathers did not approve of having a standing Army.. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 03/01/13 at 05:00:36 03342523343035510 wrote:
Correct ... I dont know how that isn't obvious to anyone - especially one who has been born and raised is US. Yea I know, they want guns ... no amount of evidence saying anything otherwise will be looked at. Y'know people are doing drugs and there is crime and there is people OD''ing on drugs etc ... I have a solution. We should have more drugs, it should be sold @ every street corner to anyone who can stumble in and plonk down the $$$. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by WebsterMark on 03/01/13 at 05:02:04 No the second amendment was put in place to protect OUR government from outside forces, hence the word militia That's not correct Retread. We can debate the meaning of the 2nd Amendment all day or you can just read what the people who wrote it thought about it. The 2nd amendment was written for two reasons: 1) protect ourselves in the event OUR government turned on us and 2) protect ourselves in the event our government was over run by outside forces. (think of the movie Red Dawn) Certainly they figured if they called up an army, most of the soldier’s would bring their own weapons. As late as the civil war when Grant accepted surrender, he let the South keep their weapons. No doubt things have changed as a few citizens could never combat a fully armed modern army. however, as we've seen in Afghanistan, armed citizens can hold off an entire nation when motivated. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 03/01/13 at 05:26:02 The USA is no afghanisthan. We dont have the near in defensible terrain, we dont have the seriously motivated fighters, and we certainly dont have home field advantage, and a 10,000 mile disadvantage. However Yes we have the second amendment to also keep out a tyrannical govt but you think the guns you have are a match for anything the govt has ? Seriously, we dont have to worry about an external force, and we are no match for the govt, so your guns are useful to shoot some poor less privileged fool or in the 1 in 100 case, for a defensive use of shooting an intruder or a wolf that has wandered into your house. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Paraquat on 03/01/13 at 06:17:04 I hate that argument. The government has much more powerful weaponry. Then what is everyone so afraid of? --Steve |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 03/01/13 at 07:00:21 The chances of our military or police force turning on the American people en mass, is pretty much nill... Even if they come to take our guns, they would not recover many, I know mine would never be found.. Again the major problem is not guns/ammo, or any other tool, it is crazy people getting their hands on these tools... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/01/13 at 09:33:27 I am correct in what I said about the 2nd amendment. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 03/01/13 at 09:52:13 52657472656164000 wrote:
And how do you propose to stop that ? Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 03/01/13 at 09:54:21 7B4A594A5A5E4A5F2B0 wrote:
No one from the govt is afraid you're going to overthrow them ... They are afraid you'd shoot your neighbor ... or worse yet, your kid finds it and shoots another kid. The govt isn't trying to save itself by gun control. They are trying to stop one trigger happy crackhead from blowing away 30 people @ the convenience store to steal 10 bucks from the register. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 03/01/13 at 09:59:48 Well, you need a license to drive a car, you need to be sane, you need to be proficient, and you need insurance on that car? |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 03/01/13 at 10:16:12 50677670676366020 wrote:
Oh yea ... that will be de-cried by the NRA and the republicons as a "goverment take over of the second amendment". And it still doesn't address the issue of one person's guns being "co-opted" by someone else cos they leave it in easy access. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/01/13 at 10:49:19 All I should NEED to do is DEmonstrate Proficiency to operate a vehicle. A License is permission From the State to do what would otherwise be illegal.. Look back in history at When marriage licenses became a requirement & ask yourself why |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Jerry Eichenberger on 03/01/13 at 11:03:05 Without intending to insult any of our members in certain parts of the country, marriage licenses were designed to do a few things, all good: Frist, to make sure that couples are of the required age. Second, to try to keep forks growing in family trees. As Jeff Foxworthy says, you know you're a redneck if your family tree has no forks. And third, in the days of rampant venerial diseases that weren't treatable, to get the couple a blood test, but this requirement has fairly well faded away. Sorry JOG, no grand conspiracy here - just good reasons. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 03/01/13 at 11:10:14 7A656364797E4F7F4F77656922100 wrote:
Applying this to guns ... I would think criminals are excellent shots. I suppose that should be enough to let em buy em huh, after all The NRA believes Gun control is hitting your target. The rest, I'm with Jerry's response on those, no need to repeat. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by verslagen1 on 03/01/13 at 11:22:14 5A55595358555E525542575542300 wrote:
That maybe another part of it, but I was told it was to reduce the chance of the baby's blood type from being incompatible with the mothers. but I've never heard of anyone being denied for this reason. |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by Retread on 03/01/13 at 12:18:06 37362D2A25302C440 wrote:
Oh yea ... that will be de-cried by the NRA and the republicons as a "goverment take over of the second amendment". And it still doesn't address the issue of one person's guns being "co-opted" by someone else cos they leave it in easy access. Cool. Srinath. [/quote] What they are doing now is being decried as a take over, if you are proficient in handling your weapons, you keep them secure.. You have door locks and keys to your car, do you not? Yes they get stolen, but imagine if they didn't have locks and keys, condition now with guns... |
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Title: Re: Adam Lanza Post by srinath on 03/01/13 at 12:50:29 Lookup NRA's stance on gun safes as well as trigger and other locks. Cool. Srinath. |
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