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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructions /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1446828836 Message started by stewmills on 11/06/15 at 08:53:56 |
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Title: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructions Post by stewmills on 11/06/15 at 08:53:56 Sorry guys, i shopped around briefly and can't put my hands on it. I am going to do some work on the bike this weekend and have the mat for this mod and am pretty sure I know what to do, but wanted to review the instructions for safety's sake. So...is there an original post with instructions or just random posts I have seen where others have done this? If we need them, I would be happy to take some step by step pics of my work so we can have an 'official' guide for this mod? Thanks! |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by youzguyz on 11/06/15 at 10:02:33 Here is the post you want: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1428436529/4#4 maybe |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by stewmills on 11/06/15 at 11:19:48 5F49535C41535F5C260 wrote:
Close enough. I primarily needed to see the pics of how they were cut, and I am glad I did...I had something a little different in mind but now I won't make that mistake. Thanks! |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Tocsik on 11/06/15 at 12:39:42 77706173696D686877040 wrote:
I would sure appreciate it! Go for it, Stew. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by KennyG on 11/06/15 at 17:48:12 Stew, I too would appreciate a step by step pics. Kenny G |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by stewmills on 11/07/15 at 22:13:47 Ok team...For your reading pleasure: Materials needed: - Black runner mat from Lowes, 1 foot (Item #: 115764) - Razor blade - Compass - Marker - Straight edge - Adhesive http://i65.tinypic.com/ziunms.jpg Step 1 Put bike on a secure lift where the rear tire is off the ground about 3 or so inches. My rig lets me get a little creative as the bike is pretty secure. If you don't have this secure of a set up, be careful and don't drop the bike! http://i65.tinypic.com/9r3tqu.jpg Step 2 If your belt runs fairly centered, before removing anything from the rear axle you first need to put a piece of tape on the lock nuts of both the left and right axle alignment brackets. What this does is keep the spot saved where your pulley is relatively centered. After you put it back together you will be fairly close to where you want to be without starting from scratch (you will likely still have to readjust a little once it's all back together). After you have taped both nuts, turn the adjustment bolt counterclockwise to loosen. By nature of loosening, the nut will loosen and turn with the bolt which is what you want. Also, loosening both of these adjusters a little makes the axle easier to slide out as it is under less tension. http://i68.tinypic.com/10opche.jpg Step 3 Unscrew the rear brake adjustment nut and take the brake cable completely loose. Careful not to lose the cylindrical spacer inside. http://i66.tinypic.com/11goku0.jpg Step 4 Put the spacer on the cable and screw the nut on to keep from losing the parts. http://i66.tinypic.com/nfgvx4.jpg Step 5 Start removing the axle nut, and once loose start working the axle out. It may come out easier if you have a piece of wood under the rear wheel where it is not dangling freely, but is as neutral as you can get it. This helps take the pressure off of the axle. You may have to tap the axle with something to get it started sliding out, just be careful not to damage the threads on the end. Use a small punch, piece of wood, or leave the nut screwed on just a few turns and use the nut as a tap. Pay attention to the order that things come off. Here is the order they go in, left to right. Note the larger of the two spacers goes on the left. Also note that there is a top and bottom to the adjusters. The top of the adjuster has the little indention in it. http://i68.tinypic.com/nn7jgw.jpg Step 6 Take the wheel off. I personally find it easier to first take off the brake drum on the right side (you have to angle the wheel to the left some and wiggle the brake drum out), then I have room to angle the tire to the right and it gives me room to wiggle the pulley out and then roll the tire out. The higher your rear wheel is off the ground the easier this is.[ch8195] http://i64.tinypic.com/eqrqch.jpg Step 7 Now that you have the wheel off, use the compass (that you probably stole from your kid's school supplies) to measure the radius from the center to the outer edge of the inside of the hub, which should be about 3.5”, which makes a diameter of 7”. http://i63.tinypic.com/28hlxya.jpg Step 8 Transfer this measurement to the mat and mark a circle about 7” diameter. http://i65.tinypic.com/2qas42f.jpg Step 9 Use the compass to measure the radius from the center to inside of the hub, which should be about 1.75”, which makes a diameter of 3.5”. Note that you don’t go all the way to the inside edge of the hub as the ‘turn up’ in the spline you see under the pencil doesn’t need to be fully covered. You will see a better example of this in subsequent images. http://i64.tinypic.com/dd2hxu.jpg Step 10 Transfer this measurement to the mat and mark a circle about 3.5” diameter. http://i67.tinypic.com/2cz9c3n.jpg Step 11 Cut out the circles. (This is not a 45rpm record. Do not try to play it on your parent's or grandparent's record player.) http://i65.tinypic.com/212a2rr.jpg Step 12 There are many ways to do this, but what I did is place the cut out circle over the pulley with the splines pointing up. I made sure it was centered and then took a silver marker and marked the edges of the splines just to get a reasonable location. This may be easier if you sit a 1 gallon paint can on it to hold it in one place...I didn't need to. I then turned the marked mat over and using a straight edge I cut the lines from the outer edge of the circle down to about 1/4” from the center hole. You don’t want to cut all the way down as this little center piece will help you keep things aligned and together later. You'll understand this better a few pictures down the road... http://i66.tinypic.com/35d0qck.jpg http://i67.tinypic.com/27zizvr.jpg http://i68.tinypic.com/2wozzgw.jpg [ch8195] http://i66.tinypic.com/2ikkt4.jpg Step 13 This should be your finished product. Depending on how good you are with a razor blade, you may need to do some fitting and trimming once you place it on your hub. Just make sure nothing appears to be binding on the hub's outer edge…it doesn’t have to fit exact and you don’t want it so perfect that the edges of the mat get stuck between the pulley and hub when you put them together. They should slide together smoothly. http://i64.tinypic.com/20ib5zr.jpg Step 14 Verifying fitment http://i65.tinypic.com/5nljsi.jpg http://i64.tinypic.com/2di0g04.jpg Side view of pulley in the hub for a test fit, and you can see that they meet up near perfect. This is what you want to end up with. A little more or less isn’t a crisis. http://i64.tinypic.com/1191qgg.jpg Step 15 Dab a little silicone (or similar adhesive) on the hub, then put the new shim (mat) on the glued hub and then sit the pulley back on it to both ensure it is centered properly and as well to hold a little pressure on it to help it stick. You just need enough to help hold it in place while you wiggle the pulley and wheel back onto the bike. Otherwise, it would keep falling out and make you say bad words. http://i64.tinypic.com/b81lyb.jpg [ch8195] http://i64.tinypic.com/mrdz4z.jpg http://i65.tinypic.com/2wr235f.jpg Step 16 Reverse the take off order and put the wheel back on. Use your own method of alignment, but personally my rig lets me securely run the bike in 1st gear with the rear wheel off the ground :o :o :o, and I can center the pulley quite accurately. If you don’t have a rig that lets you do this safely, just put things back together back to the spot they were at when you took them off (remember the tape on the adjusters!) and you should be close..and just adjust as needed. Remember to not over tighten your belt tension! The belt should be flexible enough where you can grab it on the bottom and with your thumb and forefinger twist the belt 90 degrees. Can’t do it and it’s too tight. Twist it to more than 90 degrees easily and it’s too loose. Lastly, Since I am such a nice guy and wanted to spread the holiday cheer a little early (and because I bought 3 feet of mat) I went ahead and cut out a handful of shims until I ran out of material. If you want one, PM me and I'll see what shipping is. I imagine for a few bucks I can slide it in a small envelope and get it to you. Just please understand that I am not "selling" these and not advertising them as some precision cut laser etched cutout...my tired, sore hands cut them out tonight after grouting kitchen tile until midnight Friday night and working in the yard, shop, and on the bike all day today...so my precision cutting may be a little off, but they will still do the trick. PM me if interested...just be patient as sometimes my job and/or life gets busy and I may not be on here for a day or so. http://i68.tinypic.com/2hqxevp.jpg :) |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by KennyG on 11/07/15 at 22:55:34 Stew, PM sent. Thank you for this posting. Kenny G |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Tocsik on 11/08/15 at 07:47:20 Nicely done, Stew. I like how you left the whole thing as one piece. Should make for easier installation and better long-term alignment. PM sent 8-) |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by stewmills on 11/08/15 at 07:52:21 Thanks! Kenny G and Tocsik PMs rec'd and replied. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Art Webb on 11/10/15 at 18:59:42 Cool! a tutorial and spares on offer! PM sent |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Gus on 11/10/15 at 19:27:39 I'm assuming this is the mod that takes care of the tiny bit of wobble in the rear drive pulley. If so, I need one of these too. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by stewmills on 11/10/15 at 21:39:03 gus, yes you are correct. pm's for gus and art webb rec'd and responded to. i have about 4 shims left after mailing these. $5 covers it, standard mail. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/10/15 at 22:57:31 I admire good work, and maybe I'm missing something, but wouldn't taking a piece out, outline it, cut the mat, place the mat in the wheel , stick the damper back in, etc, wouldn't that accomplish the same thing,? |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by stewmills on 11/11/15 at 06:59:02 Why Yes, jog, that would work as well as far as I can tell. I admire your perspective and the ability to see more than one solution. Unless one of the experts say otherwise it would do just the same other than someone opening up the rear pulley behind you and not seeing them down in there and being able to admire your handy work. Plus, I like the cool look of the one piece spacer as it sorta reminds me of a weird cross between the flux capacitor and the bio-hazard symbol. That combination alone makes it look very mysterious, almost top-secret like. :o |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/11/15 at 07:25:43 I thought it would work, but I get it, I used to be the mechanic, body man, equipment maintenance and I drove the trucks, for a small company that plugged and abandoned oil wells. One of the big dawgs told me one day Don't make a science project out of it... And he Needed to tell me that and I STILL find myself doing things that Could be done more quickly and easily, but dang, man, sometimes I just Gotta get all the way in and do it in a way that has some challenging aspects to it, some art, some skill. Yeah, dude, you killed it. I think you should take one and slap it on a piece of cardboard and outline it and hang it up to keep. Or shoot some paint at it, I'm hoping to get pics of the launch box I built for my grandson up soon. I'm TRYING to get him focused on something, excited, passionate about Something,,, so, I got a coupla gyroscopes, and, BTW, a good blower and 120 psi will spin one up a Lot faster than the string will,, and some Estes rockets. First one is stuck in a tree. I spent a good deal of time yesterday trying to shoot it down with the pellet gun... Gotta build another.. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Dave on 11/11/15 at 09:34:06 I don't believe it would work very well to put the floor matt shims behind the stock rubber snubber pieces. There is a nipple on them that pushes through a hole in the drum and holds them in place, and with the floor matt shim back there - I don't believe the wider part of the nipple could be pushed through far enough hold them in place. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by stewmills on 11/11/15 at 09:39:16 ;D he said nipple |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Dave on 11/11/15 at 10:37:01 I didn't know what else to call it....nubbin, projection, stubbie? :-? |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Art Webb on 11/11/15 at 11:10:53 I like 'nipple' I suspect others will, too the 'outline it in cardboard and cut it out' idea would also make a good template for doing more of them later of course, once you have one, you may never need another |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/11/15 at 17:39:59 Well, I'm really gonna try to not take full advantage of Dave and his wardrobe malfunction, exposing the heretofore unbeknownst to me, Savage nipples.. But, the question I have is, if ya pierced the mat and gave it the same hole as a wedge, is the nipple long enough to make it work? Dave, should I know why that protuberance exists without any explanation? I sure don't get it. And, maybe the snowflake is just the ticket. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Dave on 11/12/15 at 03:14:39 The nipple is there to hold the rubber cushions in place......it pushes through the hub and sticks out inside the brake drum side of the hub. It is what keeps the cushions from falling out every time you take the rear wheel off. They are just long enough to work as they are....there is no room to put the floor matt shim between the cushion and the hub. The floor matt shim needs to be on the outside. http://i67.tinypic.com/b68w2w.jpg |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/12/15 at 16:26:43 Well, dadgummitt Dave, now I gotta go Back to the shop and put you up Another Gold star. That's a fine and complete answer, thank you, sir. And now it's completely clear that the snowflake is the answer. Unless someone wants to cut out and stuff and glue individual pieces, I guess? |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Transp0rt3r on 04/03/19 at 14:45:01 Sorry for resurrecting 4-year-old thread but it helped me to track down the belt squeak AND brake shoes squeal too. :D Took the rear wheel down and tore it all apart yesterday. The rubber pads behind the pulley have indentation marks more than what I've seen in other member's pictures. Which makes me think there was more wobble with a rear pulley than should be. Going to clean it all out, do the rubber mat mod, wash the drive belt, sand brake shoes - too much glaze so they squeal. http://https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7901/40565775463_aa56b13fce_q.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/24NEcKM) http://https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7811/47531761311_aa2119f22a_q.jpg[/url] http://https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7804/47531761301_c7c5151cd2_q.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2fqdGDT) |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Dave on 04/04/19 at 03:45:26 When the pulley gets that much wobble.....it means the bearing is getting a lot of play in it. Maybe you should replace the pulley hub bearing as well? Make sure it turns smoothly and has grease in it - I believe the backside of the bearing is open and you can see the balls from the backside when you remove the spacer. (Don't forget to put the pulley hub spacer back in.....you need it!). |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Transp0rt3r on 04/04/19 at 15:31:32 Thank you, I've already put all the spacers back on the axle and mount it on to the bike. Old habit hahah this way I know the order they came off. It has grease from what I can see and turns smoothly. I'll peek from the other side and inspect the inside of the barrel. The brake side has a bearing too, not sure if I can remove it easily to peek inside. http://https://live.staticflickr.com/7907/46622809055_c3dfee6e7d_q.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2e2U5Pr) |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Dave on 04/05/19 at 03:25:37 The bearing I want you to inspect is in the pulley hub.....not the wheel hub. The single bearing in the pulley hub just isn't sufficient to handle the eccentric load....and it wears over time and allows the pulley to go out of alignment. For some reason the wheel hubs on the early bike where machined better - then the later bikes have too much clearance and allow the bearing to wear rapidly and allow pulley wobble. Remove the axle spacer in the pulley hub....and look at the bearing inside this: http://https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7901/40565775463_aa56b13fce_q.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/24NEcKM) |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Junker on 04/09/19 at 22:27:27 Is this (the rubber mat mode) and your (Daves) rear bearing mod pinned in the Tech section? |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by LuckyLuna on 09/04/23 at 07:05:45 Is there any way in hell, that we could get the pictures reposted? every one is an error so I have no idea what we're talking about here. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Armen on 09/04/23 at 07:24:59 Luckyluna Do yourself a favor and don’t even bother with shining up the pulley. Do the DragBikeMike double wide bearing conversion and really fix the problem. Easy date. You’ll need a modified left hand spacer (i do those), and a new bearing (Ebay or bearing supply). Vastly superior fix. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Ruttly on 09/04/23 at 07:47:47 Yeah DBMs bearing upgrade is really the best option , anything less isn’t fixing anything ! Belt or chain drives. It’s amazingly stable even better with nice shocks. Cheap and easy to install. |
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Title: Re: rear pulley shimming with floor mat instructio Post by Dave on 09/05/23 at 03:34:57 This is an old thread....the pulley wobble was first resolved by shims, then later an internal bearing. DragBikeMike came along with a far more elegant and lasting solution. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1561964431 You can buy the modified spacer here: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1641846528 |
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