|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Here Bot........ /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1449329245 Message started by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 07:27:25 |
|
Title: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 07:27:25 Since you won't answer my question, I will show you proof as to how history and the world views the Crusades. This is just a tidbit, from a quick INTERNET search, but the titling was all the same pretty much. Funny thing I started to read a little bit of the history, which I will mostly plead ignorance to, and saw the Crusades were sanctioned/started by the Roman Catholic Church.... Gee, don't we have a pious member round here that talks squat to others rude behavior ;D Anyway, here is an example: Timeline for the Crusades and Christian Holy War to c.1350 Historical definition of “crusade”: The crusades were a series of holy wars called by popes with the promise of indulgences for those who fought in them and directed against external and internal enemies of Christendom for the recovery of Christian property or in defense of the Church or Christian people. Crusades were characterized by the taking of vows and the granting of indulgences to those who participated. Like going on pilgrimage, to which they were often likened, crusading was an act of Christian love and piety that compensated for and paid the penalties earned by sin. It marked a break in earlier Christian medieval conceptions of warfare in that crusades were penitential warfare. Crusades combined the ideas of: a) Holy War and b) and Pilgrimage to produce the concept of "indulgence" (remission of penance and/or sin granted by papacy for participation in sacred activity). Now, you wanna state you have never associated that Christians with the Crusades in your own dialogue? Maybe we can change history and give these crusaders a new name to not offend Christians like me, and all the good ones who started schools/universities, hospitals, etc in our country and around the world, well? Shall we call them a name that will pizz them off and minimize them? Lets call them the Pope's poopers , but I am open to the left sided brain suggestions as they seem to sure have these Muslim JV Terrorist in retreat from their taunting ;D Well amigo.... its on you???? |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 07:40:44 One other thought, if I may..... ;D Wasn't this type of attitude, and action, by state sanctioned religion, on the European continent, one of the main reasons folks left only to discover America? In the early drafts of our founding fathers, it seemed they knew the importance of setting up a system of govern that would not allow this type of power to influence and rule over an open and free society from a centralized point of power, not the freedom of individuals to express their own beliefs, open, and freely, however. Which seems to be trampled on by opposing views nowadays..... Like in I get butthurt if I hear someone say Merry Christmas or God Bless You ;D |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by Serowbot on 12/05/15 at 07:49:30 Sometimes, I just can't follow your logic... You ask questions without posing them... Anybody get this?... :-/... |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 08:03:34 Anybody wanna try to help out bot? |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by mpescatori on 12/05/15 at 11:54:08 61726A77726474130 wrote:
YYYUP ! 53405845405646210 wrote:
No, Sir, it wasn't. By the tone and contents of your question I assume you are: a. white, b. anglosaxon or germanic (or polish or scandinavian or slavic) c. have only studied History of the World as described in High School history books. During the 16th century the only ones to explore the new ContinentS (there were two, you know) were the military and the clergy. The first successfull settlements were garrisons. To call the Pilgrim Fathers' settlement "successful" is a mistake, it should be classed in the same way as shipwrecked castaways saved by a passing ship,. i.e. a fluke of fortune and nothing else. OR the story of Thanksgiving has changed since 1998. In the 17th century the first "civilians" to populate North America were criminals sentenced to the gallows and proposed to "colonize the Colonies" as an alternative - quite often the entire family followed suit. Others, from Germany, the Netherlands and France emigrated to flee from war, famine and desease. Precious few, if any at all, emigrated because of religious intolerance; this includes the Pilgrim Fathers, if you take the time to read their entire story. As for the Crusades, yes, they were, by today's standards, not what you would call "holy wars". Quite possibly 100 years from now Hiroshima and Nagasaki will be called a crime against humanity and all that. But, just like "the Bomb" seemed a bright idea to Pres. Truman in 1945... the Crusades seemed a good idea way back then. Who knows... maybe King Ferdinand and Queen Isabella shouldn't have allowed that crazy Genoese Captain to sail at all... ;) |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 12:42:55 Stike one! I am American Indian..... However, you are pretty close in other assumptions. My great grandfather on my mothers side was in fact a German emigrant who went west to trap. He stole my great grandmother off the reservation and married her. I even have pictures of this, which are way cool. Yes, my history lesson is public school and what they deemed appropriate, I reckon. You dude seem to hold your views and knowledge as surperior and factual, even prolly to the point you think your beliefs are unique and novel, withhout prejudice and bias, all us other heathens have been tainted with.... Your glib reference to Truman et al, is nothing but your own crock, and is a simple extension of your ego and folly, for history can not be undone or proven, key word here amigo..... Proven, by its vey nature. You want to stroke yourself with Monday morning quarterbacking, be my guess, for we could all have a hoot talking Italy's history and their self imposed importance..... |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by pg on 12/05/15 at 16:12:30 43504855504656310 wrote:
Are you an enrolled member of a Tribe? What is your CIB? Best regards, |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 16:31:02 Gee.... Seems some of this thread went bye bye :-/ Yes, I am registered in the Quapaw Tribe...... However, since its a plains tribe, and located in Oklahoma, I am not issued fishing rights free from the gubbermint restrictions like PacNorWest tribes, dang it ;D We were a poor tribe, only had a gas station and tobacco store for many generations. Now, due to many changing circumstances, we have become a tribe with many changing opportunities. Under new leadership our tribe is one of the biggest employers in the region. It has many wonderful programs it offers to people in need as well as taking care of its membership. Here is a link to its casino-resort. http://www.downstreamcasino.com/ Sadly, not a single full-blooded member is alive anymore, but the traditions are passed on and savored. My children are members too, oh..... I am only 1/4th, but that is the biggest chunk of my mutthood ;D |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 18:00:04 For the moment, I am not even going to attempt to comment on everyone's posts here. They seem kinda scary :-? :-X. Bot, I guess Raydawg is trying to accuse you of relating the Crusades to Christianity :-?, which is not particularly unusual. ;) I think the idea he is trying to propose is that the Crusades suck, the Crusaders suck, and that we should rename them the "pope's poopers" simply because we Christians want nothing to do with those stupid, lousy, stinkin', murderous blankety-blank blank blanks ;) Plain English Version :D |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 18:14:34 By the way, my Dad supposedly has Cherokee ancestry, but messing in Indian affairs is not my cup of tea, especially since I don't look like one. I took after my Mom's looks ;) I doubt any of my family has any official papers or anything like that. That's another reason. |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 18:16:49 313A3733223C3725306066520 wrote:
How ::) |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 18:20:09 My mother's side is pretty much white European, if that tells you anything. |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 18:22:09 474C4145544A4153461610240 wrote:
Gee...... you must have an advanced degree in Cryptanalysis, that would explain Bots inability to grasp something so rudimentary ::) I wonder if he said it aloud he might hear the hypocrisy within it? |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 18:26:56 I guess I feel a little intimidated, like I have no say in Indian affairs... like I'm not Indian enough or something. :-/ :-[ I've never been to a reservation, and I certainly don't have papers. Unless my family is mistaken, I have Cherokee ancestry, but I'm not officially a Cherokee. :-? :-[ |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 18:30:02 45564E53564050370 wrote:
Gee...... you must have an advanced degree in Cryptanalysis, that would explain Bots inability to grasp something so rudimentary ::) I wonder if he said it aloud he might hear the hypocrisy within it? [/quote] Revealing Bot's hypocrisy by quoting me? Revealing my hypocrisy by stating it aloud instead of writing it? I don't fully understand here? Who's the hypocrite and how and why? I would assume you're referring to Bot, but I don't quite understand what you're saying. |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/05/15 at 19:02:35 313A3733223C3725306066520 wrote:
Gee...... you must have an advanced degree in Cryptanalysis, that would explain Bots inability to grasp something so rudimentary ::) I wonder if he said it aloud he might hear the hypocrisy within it? [/quote] Revealing Bot's hypocrisy by quoting me? Revealing my hypocrisy by stating it aloud instead of writing it? I don't fully understand here? Who's the hypocrite and how and why? I would assume you're referring to Bot, but I don't quite understand what you're saying. [/quote] Too funny, or maybe i am just waaaaaaaaaaaaaay out there ;D When I asked "how" I was showing you I can speak Indian tongue ;) And the other post was in reference to "bot" claiming he didn't get what you quickly got..... Make sense now? I hope it did, I typed real slow ;D Sorry, always the clown I am :) |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 19:13:12 "How" kinda hit me as having a double meaning, so I didn't fully get the joke. I just was wondering who was the hypocrite and how? I found your comment on Bot's hypocrisy to be a little confusing. Maybe ol' Serobot didn't really try to understand it. Maybe he just skimmed it once and thought that was enough :P. |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 19:17:24 1107100D15000D16620 wrote:
Raydawg, is this what you say would make him sound hypocritical if he said it aloud? |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by cheapnewb24 on 12/05/15 at 19:22:16 If Bot is only pretending not to understand, then why? :-? Does he not want to answer? :-? Is he waiting until you write something he can pounce upon? :-? If so, I think Serowbot should read us our Miranda rights ;D ;D |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by mpescatori on 12/06/15 at 03:30:19 786B736E6B7D6D0A0 wrote:
OK, which means to my understanding you would resent in anyone describing ALL American settlers as GOOD and ALL American Indians as BAD, to say the least. Quote:
Er, actually, NO. The Crusades are the history of Europe, plain and simple. Wherever you go today in Italy and France you will find not ruins but living villages which are named after Crusader history, because the Knights Templars or the Knights of Malta had a garrison there which provided shelter to pilgrims and haven from robbers hiding in the woods. The Crusades are the story of Europe meaning the story of my People. Quite simply, we don't study the Middle Ages as "the Dark Ages of woe and famine" much less as a fairy tale with castles and knights and dragons and ladies in distress... My own history book of the Middle Ages in High School was a good 300+ pages, from the last sacking of Rome in 476 to the discovery of America in 1492. Quote:
I studied that portion of US history way back then, my history teacher was E.Richard Michaelson (jewish) and he had us write a term paper on "the Bomb", asking us to dissert whether the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki was a good idea or not. The point is, even if you go and read University-level history books, they will all agree in saying that "the Bomb" did seem a good idea to Pres. Truman (else, he wouldn't have approved it). Or... are you telling me that the Generals in the Pentagon had pressed Pres. Truman into a corner and pressured him into signing a document he disapproved? Don't you understand I am actually defending him ? :-? Quote:
A Nation's importance is always related to a specific time in history. From the fall of the Roman Empire in Rome, the ONE power in Europe was Greece, home to the Roman Empire of the East. Then came France under the Capets etc. up to the 16th Century. Then came Spain with its conquests of Central and South America. England and the UK became big and powerful thanks to the "Seven Years' War" (French&Indian to you) and maintained their status up to WW1. Americans tend to dismiss the Moorish, Persian and Turkish Empires... but see how wide they spanned... and I'm only talking about the Mediterranean Basin. Are the US a World Power ? Yes, they became THE World Power in 1945 because of all victor states they were the only one never to be physically damaged by the war (not including the bombing of Pearl Harbor... but nobody ever bombed Detroit, New Yor City or Bostoin, did they?) The US remained THE world Power after they beat the USSR in a financial war to high technology, but started losing out when the Treasury decided to unlink the US Dollar from the value of gold... That's when the price of oil skyrocketed and "emerging nations" (India, Brazil, South Africa) started growing. Who will be "#1 Nation" in 2050 ? I don't know... maybe China, maybe India, maybe Brazil... ...maybe the Congo might be in 2100... As for Italy... Up until 1861 Italy was really just a geographical expression... ...but way back in those same Middle Ages which you claim to know so well, Tuscany was the center of commerce, banking and, oh, THE ARTS ! Leonardo da Vinci, Michelangelo Buonarroti, Raffaello, Giotto, Cimabue, Bernini, Donatello but also Dante, Machiavelli, Petrarca... If they weren't born there they did their apprenticeship there... What is Tuscany today ? A Region (=State to you) within the Republic of Italy. What is Italy ? A Member State within the European Union. What is the European Union? A project, work in progress, among nations with 1000+ years of national identity, which means it is very difficult to convince many to relinquish their national sovereignty "for the common good". But way back in 1781... read hisotry books... the one most commonly used currency used in the newbord United States of America was the Spanish Dobloon... because you had just thrown out the English Pound... ...and people spoke Dutch and German in Pennsylvania. I'm not making this up, this is what I learned in school. Ellen Glasgow Junior High. Have a happy weekend. |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by raydawg on 12/06/15 at 06:23:45 Ok...... Too much here to cover, but I will try a simple answer, hoping it explains who/what/why/where, I view myself and the world. I don't, or make that , I try, to not have expectations of others, as it will most always lead to resentments, like you refer to, for in doing so it burdens me, or another way to say it, is it lets others live in my mind rent free..... As to all the history you shared, I am not in anyway, vested in a position to argue its authenticity. However, I do know, and I hold it as fact, that who ever tells the story, written or speaking, controls the information. Example, studies have shown testimony in courts of eyewitness's, which the courts decree as more worthy of consideration, are not what we once believed. That one persons eyewitness has often been the foundation for others to develop their belief around even if the have to convince themselves that what they thought they saw, they didn't. Don't want to really get any deeper into this discussion, for dialogue in person is hard enough, this format next to impossible ;D I do love the simplicity of old adages, as they have survived scrutiny and time.... And I think all this can be reduced to the wisdom of this one: “YOU CAN’T REALLY UNDERSTAND ANOTHER PERSON’S EXPERIENCE UNTIL YOU’VE WALKED A MILE IN THEIR SHOES.” PS: How many folk would willing take their shoes off, to let another walk in them today? I think most fear the scrutiny of the new wearer ;) |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/06/15 at 06:58:37 Have to walk the first few miles, to grasp the basis for an individuals sense of self, and a few others,, but, point is, Really understanding someone takes more than tossing barbs back and forth.. |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by mpescatori on 12/07/15 at 01:07:24 " I think all this can be reduced to the wisdom of this one: “YOU CAN’T REALLY UNDERSTAND ANOTHER PERSON’S EXPERIENCE UNTIL YOU’VE WALKED A MILE IN THEIR SHOES.” PS: How many folk would willing take their shoes off, to let another walk in them today? I think most fear the scrutiny of the new wearer " Well said, Raydawg, well said :) AND Think twice before you insist someone walk in your shoes... ...you will be left with no shoes, and they will have two pair... ;) |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by thumperclone on 12/07/15 at 09:00:19 were not the crusades waged to counter the expansion of islam? |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by mpescatori on 12/07/15 at 14:59:53 The first one certainly was. The Emperor of the (only one left) Roman Empire (in Byzantium) cried for help to the Pope because the Turks (unknown to Asia Minor before then) were crawling up from ASyria into (what is today called) Kurdistan and spreading into Anatolia (the Central Plain) http://https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9b/Justinian555AD.png/250px-Justinian555AD.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine_Empire#/media/File:Justinian555AD.png The Empire at its greatest extension in 555AD http://https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/Byzantiumby650AD.svg/300px-Byzantiumby650AD.svg.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine_Empire#/media/File:Byzantiumby650AD.svg The Empire in 650AD after the Arabs had conquered Syria http://https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/85/Byzantiumforecrusades.jpg/250px-Byzantiumforecrusades.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/85/Byzantiumforecrusades.jpg The Empire after the Turkik hordes invaded from the East. In the days of Ancient Greece etc. Anatolia was inhabited by Hittites etc., i.e. white peoples. Even today, real Syrians are white, Bedouins are tan. Anatolians are white. This guy is white, blue eyed, and belongs to a lasting dynasty of Officers serving his National Army. http://https://media.licdn.com/mpr/mpr/shrinknp_200_200/p/5/005/0b0/2bd/0ecb499.jpg He is Turkish, a real gentlemen of yore and a dear colleague of mine. |
|
Title: Re: Here Bot........ Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/07/15 at 15:23:24 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bretton_Woods_system Then, consider the hits found here, Search Saudi Arabia buys T bills with money we buy oil with Understand that every dollar spent is Borrowed from the Fed, which We pay interest on. It's impossible for that to continue indefinitely. Note the rise of the debt, and decreased living conditions. Tiny House Nation, coming your way? Will that be the new normal? |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |