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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> what's it gonna take? /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1495658801 Message started by justin_o_guy2 on 05/24/17 at 13:46:41 |
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Title: what's it gonna take? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/24/17 at 13:46:41 How many tragedies that make worldwide news , EACH AND EVERY ONE connected by One Common Element must we see before TRUTH ABOUT THE PROBLEM is greater than the IDIOTIC PC REQUIREMENTS THAT OVERRIDE COMMON SENSE that the mentally ill people who seem to believe that IF you call a rattlesnake The World's most Beloved Unicorn then it won't Bite? I'm DONE dancing with you people. Your opinion is nothing. Wake up. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/24/17 at 13:54:57 405F595E43447545754D5F53182A0 wrote:
I agree! Religion is the root of it all!!! (there has never been a terrorist attack that came from atheists...) |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/24/17 at 13:56:07 But, we need to import that? |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/24/17 at 18:18:28 There's nothing you can do Jog. See my other post about Anchorman II. We've got people in position of authority in this country who are fools, absolute fools. It's right in front of them, but they walk right off the cliff. But then again, look at our universities. Here in Missouri, we just hired a new, future ex-President of Mizzou. BLM and the MSM destroyed, absolutely destroyed that college. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/24/17 at 18:41:52 Just saw this..... Yea, if there was only some pattern that we could figure out.... Abedi: VISITED SYRIA & LIBYA Rahami: ..PAKISTAN Farook: ..SAUDI ARABIA Abdulazeez: ..JORDAN Tsarnaev: ..DAGESTAN If only there's a pattern. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by oldNslow on 05/24/17 at 19:26:10 Quote:
If you are serious, and not just being facetious, that's quite possibly the stupidest thing anyone has said yet in this discussion. There is only ONE religion that is the root of the carnage that is taking place all over the world right now. Just one. Islam. Or do you suppose it's them radical militant Presbyterians causing all the trouble. Cuttin' off heads and blowin'up children and whatnot. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by raydawg on 05/25/17 at 04:09:02 4977767A6874751B0 wrote:
Not to mention atheist regimes that kill their own as well..... However, this is a stupid F'n argument. TT, likes to ride others for comparing Obama, Hillary, etc, to Trump, as in, "your momma is fatter than my momma" rationale, as if that excuses the original issue. It SOLVES nothing, just like our government, they blame the opposition, and the sheep fn believe it.....stupid mindless robots! TT, you really should read outside your comfort zone. Here, let me suggest this article: Oh, before I do, let me state for the record, yes, many religious zealots have killed under their own religious applicability, HOWEVER, like how you want to defend Muslims, against THEIR zealots, but then cast your net all over other religions, prolly with Christianity at the top of your list... your selective outrage, or argument is wearing thin, to the point of irrelevance, dead id dead, and no PC bullchit can change that, pal. Start thinking for yourself, geez. Deflecting is just mental laziness, or the inability to defend your argument...... https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4076 |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 06:40:06 just last week when that Christian blew himself up at the Katy Perry concert ....oh wait, that didn't happen. earlier this year, when that Christian ran over the students at Berkeley.... oh wait, that didn't happen either. in Brazil, where those Christians threw gays off of rooftops, oh wait that didn't happen either ....... did you ever see that stupid little bumper sticker with religious symbols organized in such a way that says Coexist? The reality is if you just get rid of the crescent moon for C, things pretty much turn peaceful. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 06:51:40 Hmmmm... where did I say Christian?..... I simply said RELIGION.... Sorry to break your bubble boys... RELIGION is the common factor here. Be it Islam with the suicide bombers, or Christianity with dylan roof.... Own it - religion is indeed the common factor. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by raydawg on 05/25/17 at 07:01:16 273936373A273C21530 wrote:
No, HATE...... Is the common factor. No, let's make that PEOPLE, not the gun, bomb, or religion or lack of.... Why you need to assign more to it changes nothing. Read the article |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 07:15:22 6E7D65787D6B7B1C0 wrote:
No, HATE...... Is the common factor. No, let's make that PEOPLE, not the gun, bomb, or religion or lack of.... Why you need to assign more to it changes nothing. Read the article [/quote] Um, the article says "And this is where the meat of these debates is usually found, splitting hairs on which regime is atheist, which is merely secular, which is non-Christian and thus fair game to be called atheist." That is a completely false statement!! It's a non-starter. You simply cannot call non-Christians atheists. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by raydawg on 05/25/17 at 07:58:28 716F60616C716A77050 wrote:
No, HATE...... Is the common factor. No, let's make that PEOPLE, not the gun, bomb, or religion or lack of.... Why you need to assign more to it changes nothing. Read the article [/quote] Um, the article says "And this is where the meat of these debates is usually found, splitting hairs on which regime is atheist, which is merely secular, which is non-Christian and thus fair game to be called atheist." That is a completely false statement!! It's a non-starter. You simply cannot call non-Christians atheists. [/quote] C'mon, you are smarter than that! The subject is religion vs. secular as who has killed more. The author is merely replying to a posed question that prolly was formulated by a Christian.... That does not change the foundation of the question. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 08:16:09 75667E63667060070 wrote:
Well, as one example, hitler's storm troopers had "god is with us" on their belt buckles and the propaganda of the time mentioned "when looking at a cross, think of the what the Jews did to us" (that's paraphrased) I dunno - sounds like a religious based slant to me.... |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Serowbot on 05/25/17 at 08:24:27 Imagine there's no heaven It's easy if you try No hell below us Above us only sky Imagine all the people living for today Imagine there's no countries It isn't hard to do Nothing to kill or die for And no religion too Imagine all the people living life in peace, you You may say I'm a dreamer But I'm not the only one I hope some day you'll join us And the world will be as one Imagine no possessions I wonder if you can No need for greed or hunger A brotherhood of man Imagine all the people sharing all the world, you You may say I'm a dreamer But I'm not the only one I hope some day you'll join us And the world will be as one |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 08:40:50 Dumbest song lyrics ever written. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 09:05:42 526067767160774864776E050 wrote:
I guess that's why it was sooooo unpopular, huh? Yeah, it doesn't hold a candle to ted (poop my pants) nugent's "jailbait".....lol |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Serowbot on 05/25/17 at 09:18:09 647A757479647F62100 wrote:
I guess that's why it was sooooo unpopular, huh? Yeah, it doesn't hold a candle to ted (poop my pants) nugent's "jailbait".....lol[/quote] Ol' Web is consistent, ain't he?... ;D |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/25/17 at 09:31:33 I like the song, a lot. I was broke and very selective about the way I spent my money, but I had that tape as soon as I could get it. Funny thing is, if He's as Correct in his lyrics about the way things Ought to Be, then you should look at the part about the borderless world. Is that your desire, also? I could really dig it, IF the power that defines what society should be is good, sane, just, honest,, and watching the past fifty years and seeing lies and watching the goal of the globalist be slowly realized, I'm not looking forward to your future. It's Called Imagine, because utopia and Kum Bay Yahh aren't Gonna Happen in this world. That was never going to be. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Serowbot on 05/25/17 at 09:50:17 425D5B5C41467747774F5D511A280 wrote:
Of course not... The song is intentionally naive and simplistic in order to make a point... The world will never be that way,.. but the song may change some people that listen... The world will always be run by the few rich and influential... "Deep State" "Globalist",.. whatever... too... ..but that don't stop your wanting to change it... Maybe that song had a little to do with that... If you want the world to change... be the change. Be the man your dog thinks you are... ;D |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by raydawg on 05/25/17 at 10:03:20 4254435E46535E45310 wrote:
Of course not... The song is intentionally naive and simplistic in order to make a point... The world will never be that way,.. but the song may change some people that listen... The world will always be run by the few rich and influential... "Deep State" "Globalist",.. whatever... too... ..but that don't stop your wanting to change it... Maybe that song had a little to do with that... If you want the world to change... be the change. Be the man your dog thinks you are... ;D [/quote] You coulda saved a lot of bandwidth, and just called it, hope ;D The day we lose imagination, we rot.... |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 10:13:49 Ironically, his description is Heaven. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 10:15:33 4650475A42575A41350 wrote:
I guess that's why it was sooooo unpopular, huh? Yeah, it doesn't hold a candle to ted (poop my pants) nugent's "jailbait".....lol[/quote] Ol' Web is consistent, ain't he?... ;D [/quote] Consistently logical and correct, 99% of the time anyway. What the hell does Ted Nugent have to do with this? |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 10:20:22 073532232435221D31223B500 wrote:
I guess that's why it was sooooo unpopular, huh? Yeah, it doesn't hold a candle to ted (poop my pants) nugent's "jailbait".....lol[/quote] Ol' Web is consistent, ain't he?... ;D [/quote] Consistently logical and correct, 99% of the time anyway. What the hell does Ted Nugent have to do with this?[/quote] teddy poopy is a well known conservative moron.... John Lennon was a well known liberal... Look at the writing prowess of them both. One changed the fabric of music - the other grabs his junk and threatens liberals. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 11:38:48 LOL.... If you want to get into a game of stupid liberals vs stupid conservatives, you'll lose every time. I've gone down the road before with a game of "hate directed towards Obama" vs "hate directed towards Bush". Not even close. Let's play a different game. Let's play "put your money where you mouth is" and place a bet if Trump resigns or is impeached before end of summer. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/25/17 at 11:49:38 What's wrong with people? As many times as the media has TOLD US WHO someone is, why buy it? They paint Everything with agenda driven bullshit. Both sides. When you are getting it from both sides, like the run up lies to Iraq, it's time to slow down and look. How many times have we seen The Bad Guy , painted as Eeevill by both sides, wind up being Not so bad, after they are dead? The ESTABLISHMENT Showed us how United they are against trump. What do you think it means when hubs Unite against their nominee? We are seeing a coup against a duly elected president, and the cheerleaders, the SAME GENIUSES who supported Bamicare and open borders are clapping in the glee only the mentally deficient can feel. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Serowbot on 05/25/17 at 11:53:43 340601101706112E021108630 wrote:
Impeachment is a sloooow process... and with a Repub Congress and Senate, it will be sloooooower... Imagine Watergate happening in Jello... It'll take that long,.. if it happens at all. Whether it happens or not, is up to the Repub's. Trump has to be so bad,... it destroys their personal chances for re-lection. I think that point is coming. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 11:56:55 556760717667704F637069020 wrote:
Sounds like someone has a gambling problem. Thanks, but no thanks. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/25/17 at 12:00:30 It's not gambling when you know the answer. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Serowbot on 05/25/17 at 12:06:05 Ten bucks Trump says somethin' stupid today... ;D |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 12:08:02 352A2C2B3631003000382A266D5F0 wrote:
You honestly think it's about the establishment??? tweety is just plain bad. He's a terrible leader, knows nothing about the job that he was elected to. He speaks like a child, he acts like a child. It's been what, 120 days - and what has he done? Have you really looked at his budget? His "wall" is a joke. His ban on immigration is unconstitutional. His health care plan is WORSE than Obamacare. His cabinet is crumbling under the pressure of investigation. And again - we're only 120 days in! This is not about the establishment sabotaging this president. This is about an inept moron in charge of our country. The electorate made a mistake. They voted for change, and instead they got ineptitude - mostly because the dnc backed the wrong candidate. The country bet on tweety - and now we're seeing that it's a losing bet. The biggest problem is - none of his base want to admit it. Nothing more than that. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by MShipley on 05/25/17 at 12:10:28 Dylan Roof was not a Christian, his parents may be and he may have attended a church but he never claimed to be a Christian. Further more, he did not commit his crimes to further the Gospel of Jesus nor did he commit his crimes in the name of God, Jesus or anyone else. He did it because he was a racist that wanted to start a race war. It had nothing to do with Christianity. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by MShipley on 05/25/17 at 12:12:30 PS, for the first time in a long time I was inspired by the way our President and First lady presented themselves and America to a foreign country over the last few days. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 12:31:54 564873726B777E621B0 wrote:
Wait, he went to a Christian church, but that doesn't make him a Christian?? There's a prophetic statement that the neocons should learn about... But that's a discussion for another time... Ask ANY average Muslim about terrorist acts. EVERY SINGLE ONE will say - "they are not Muslim, they are terrorists". Terrorists are using their interpretations of their religion to justify what they do. No, maybe roof didn't do it "in the name of God", but it was nothing more than terrorism. Be it ISIS or right wingers - it's based on their own perceived superiority to others. Regardless of what you might think or are led to believe, Islam does NOT encourage killing infidels any more than does the Judaeo-Christian faith. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 12:43:09 2E300B0A130F061A630 wrote:
BWAAAHAAHAAHAAH!!!!! Really? You're good with tweety bowing to a Saudi prince? Did you like the 2 hand slaps that melania gave tweety? How about him being "exhausted" in 2 days - that's supposedly why he said "Islamic" instead of "Islamist". Hmmm... I don't think Obama ever made that mistake. How about the total embarrassment of benni when tweety says "just so you understand — I never mentioned the word or the name Israel in conversation. Never mentioned it" Yeah... he's been great! <<<<< sarcasm |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by MShipley on 05/25/17 at 12:46:49 Once again your Bigotry and Hate are just amazing. Regardless of what you might think or are led to believe, Islam does NOT encourage killing infidels any more than does the Judaeo-Christian faith. Ref. above. If you believe this, you are simply delusional. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 13:57:18 031D26273E222B374E0 wrote:
Well, at least you're proud of tweety, huh?! LMAO!!!! |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 15:59:42 3127302D35202D36420 wrote:
$20 bucks you do. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Serowbot on 05/25/17 at 16:11:56 That's a given... ;D |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 16:15:58 Ask ANY average Muslim about terrorist acts. EVERY SINGLE ONE will say - "they are not Muslim, they are terrorists". Terrorists are using their interpretations of their religion to justify what they do. Seriously, wanna put a bet on that?! Define average. An average Muslim in many places in the world think it's acceptable to blow themselves up in order to kill enemies of Allah. And remember, the nail bomber who blew those little girls apart, would have told you TT if you had asked him; "they're not Muslims, they're terrorist " This is the point you can't seem to get is we don't know who is and who isn't a terrorist, we don't know who has and who hasn't been radicalized to the point they're ready to attack. I said years ago, this is like fighting a war in your neighborhood against your neighbors, but your enemies are only the people born on a Tuesday, but not everyone born on Tuesday is part of the war. You look at all of them durning a block party, at the store or something and you can't tell which ones are plotting to kill you. All we know in the real world case is there is one and only one common thread: Islam. And within that group is a subset with ties to certain Isalmic nations. We can keep narrowing that down to make the unknown group smaller and smaller, but liberalism gets in the way for nothing more than political gain. The judge who stopped the travel ban is an absolute fool, a traitor. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Serowbot on 05/25/17 at 16:28:30 Tell that to the 470,000 dead 117,000 detained, and 6.1 million displaced in Syria... World report 2017... According to the Syrian Center for Policy Research, an independent Syrian research organization, the death toll from the conflict as of February 2016 was 470,000. The spread and intensification of fighting has led to a dire humanitarian crisis, with 6.1 million internally displaced people and 4.8 million seeking refuge abroad, according to the UN Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs. By mid-2016, an estimated 1 million people were living in besieged areas and denied life-saving assistance and humanitarian aid. More than 117,000 have been detained or disappeared since 2011, the vast majority by government forces, including 4,557 between January and June 2016, according to the Syrian Network for Human Rights. Torture and ill-treatment are rampant in detention facilities; thousands have died in detention. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by oldNslow on 05/25/17 at 16:36:00 Quote:
Good to know. I can't help but notice though, that a bunch of Islamists seem to be doing exactly that. Probably just a coincidence. ::) |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 17:37:42 437176676071665975667F140 wrote:
LOL - no, liberalism doesn't get in the way - common sense (and the Constitution) steers us from the cliff! That cliff has a slippery slope. You start banning Muslims, then what about radical Jews? Then what about non-Christians all together? Then what about certain Christian sects? etc... etc....etc |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 17:39:04 320C0D01130F0E600 wrote:
And it's a good thing that Christians never kill infidels.... oh wait... |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by oldNslow on 05/25/17 at 17:51:31 716F60616C716A77050 wrote:
And it's a good thing that Christians never kill infidels.... oh wait... [/quote] Even if true, that's utterly and totally irrelevant to the present state of affairs. It isn't Christians, or atheists, or Druids, or fill in the blank_____, who are doing it right now, in the name of their religious ideology. But we both know who is. Don't we? |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 17:59:24 392728292439223F4D0 wrote:
And it's a good thing that Christians never kill infidels.... oh wait... [/quote] In the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit? Pretty darn rare. When you hear a story about a bomb going off in a subway killing dozens, no one's first thought is another Christian just blew himself up. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 18:29:32 7C42434F5D41402E0 wrote:
And it's a good thing that Christians never kill infidels.... oh wait... [/quote] Even if true, that's utterly and totally irrelevant to the present state of affairs. It isn't Christians, or atheists, or Druids, or fill in the blank_____, who are doing it right now, in the name of their religious ideology. But we both know who is. Don't we?[/quote] Yeah, we do know - they're called "terrorists". |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 18:35:00 794B4C5D5A4B5C634F5C452E0 wrote:
And it's a good thing that Christians never kill infidels.... oh wait... [/quote] In the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit? Pretty darn rare. When you hear a story about a bomb going off in a subway killing dozens, no one's first thought is another Christian just blew himself up. [/quote] Yeah, just like when you hear about a lynching: http://www.thenation.com/article/lynching-university-maryland-campus/ Or a hate killing: http://www.mediamatters.org/blog/2016/11/04/white-racist-kills-two-cops-iowa-ambush-and-fox-news-goes-quiet/214294 |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by oldNslow on 05/25/17 at 18:42:10 687679787568736E1C0 wrote:
And it's a good thing that Christians never kill infidels.... oh wait... [/quote] Even if true, that's utterly and totally irrelevant to the present state of affairs. It isn't Christians, or atheists, or Druids, or fill in the blank_____, who are doing it right now, in the name of their religious ideology. But we both know who is. Don't we?[/quote] Yeah, we do know - they're called "terrorists". [/quote] You left out a word. "Islamic" Semantic games don't change the facts even if you insist on pretending that they are not what they are. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by pg on 05/25/17 at 19:31:10 554B444548554E53210 wrote:
Did you even read the first article. He wasn't lynched, he was stabbed. What does that have to do with Christianity as well. :-/ Best regards, |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by pg on 05/25/17 at 19:43:13 2F313E3F322F34295B0 wrote:
The Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers for the sake of Islamic rule. Some are quite graphic, with commands to chop off heads and fingers and kill infidels wherever they may be hiding. Muslims who do not join the fight are called 'hypocrites' and warned that Allah will send them to Hell if they do not join the slaughter. Quran Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief or unrest] is worse than killing... but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun(the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)" (Translation is from the Noble Quran) The verse prior to this (190) refers to "fighting for the cause of Allah those who fight you" leading some to claim that the entire passage refers to a defensive war in which Muslims are defending their homes and families. The historical context of this passage is not defensive warfare, however, since Muhammad and his Muslims had just relocated to Medina and were not under attack by their Meccan adversaries. In fact, the verses urge offensive warfare, in that Muslims are to drive Meccans out of their own city (which they later did). Verse 190 thus means to fight those who offer resistance to Allah's rule (ie. Muslim conquest). The use of the word "persecution" by some Muslim translators is disingenuous - the actual Arabic words for persecution (idtihad) - and oppression are not used instead of fitna. Fitna can mean disbelief, or the disorder that results from unbelief or temptation. A strict translation is 'sedition,' meaning rebellion against authority (the authority being Allah). This is certainly what is meant in this context since the violence is explicitly commissioned "until religion is for Allah" - ie. unbelievers desist in their unbelief. [Editor's note: these notes have been modified slightly after a critic misinterpreted our language. Verse 193 plainly says that 'fighting' is sanctioned even if the fitna 'ceases'. This is about religious order, not real persecution.] Quran (2:244) - "Then fight in the cause of Allah, and know that Allah Heareth and knoweth all things." Quran (2:216) - "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not." Not only does this verse establish that violence can be virtuous, but it also contradicts the myth that fighting is intended only in self-defense, since the audience was obviously not under attack at the time. From the Hadith, we know that this verse was narrated at a time that Muhammad was actually trying to motivate his people into raiding merchant caravans for loot. Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help." Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority". This speaks directly of polytheists, yet it also includes Christians, since they believe in the Trinity (ie. what Muhammad incorrectly believed to be 'joining companions to Allah'). Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." The martyrs of Islam are unlike the early Christians, who were led meekly to the slaughter. These Muslims are killed in battle as they attempt to inflict death and destruction for the cause of Allah. This is the theological basis for today's suicide bombers. Quran (4:76) - "Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah…" Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks." Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those of the believers who sit (at home), except those who are disabled (by injury or are blind or lame, etc.), and those who strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with their wealth and their lives. Allah has preferred in grades those who strive hard and fight with their wealth and their lives above those who sit (at home).Unto each, Allah has promised good (Paradise), but Allah has preferred those who strive hard and fight, above those who sit (at home) by a huge reward " This passage criticizes "peaceful" Muslims who do not join in the violence, letting them know that they are less worthy in Allah's eyes. It also demolishes the modern myth that "Jihad" doesn't mean holy war in the Quran, but rather a spiritual struggle. Not only is this Arabic word (mujahiduna) used in this passage, but it is clearly not referring to anything spiritual, since the physically disabled are given exemption. (The Hadith reveals the context of the passage to be in response to a blind man's protest that he is unable to engage in Jihad, which would not make sense if it meant an internal struggle). Quran (4:104) - "And be not weak hearted in pursuit of the enemy; if you suffer pain, then surely they (too) suffer pain as you suffer pain..." Is pursuing an injured and retreating enemy really an act of self-defense? Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement" Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them" No reasonable person would interpret this to mean a spiritual struggle. The targets of violence are "those who disbelieve" - further defined in the next verse (13) as "defy and disobey Allah." Nothing is said about self-defense. In fact, the verses in sura 8 were narrated shortly after a battle provoked by Muhammad, who had been trying to attack a lightly-armed caravan to steal goods belonging to other people. Quran (8:15) - "O ye who believe! When ye meet those who disbelieve in battle, turn not your backs to them. (16)Whoso on that day turneth his back to them, unless maneuvering for battle or intent to join a company, he truly hath incurred wrath from Allah, and his habitation will be hell, a hapless journey's end." Quran (8:39) - "And fight with them until there is no more fitna (disorder, unbelief) and religion is all for Allah" Some translations interpret "fitna" as "persecution", but the traditional understanding of this word is not supported by the historical context (See notes for 2:193). The Meccans were simply refusing Muhammad access to their city during Haj. Other Muslims were allowed to travel there - just not as an armed group, since Muhammad had declared war on Mecca prior to his eviction. The Meccans were also acting in defense of their religion, as it was Muhammad's intention to destroy their idols and establish Islam by force (which he later did). Hence the critical part of this verse is to fight until "religion is only for Allah", meaning that the true justification of violence was the unbelief of the opposition. According to the Sira (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 324) Muhammad further explains that "Allah must have no rivals." Quran (8:57) - "If thou comest on them in the war, deal with them so as to strike fear in those who are behind them, that haply they may remember." Quran (8:67) - "It is not for a Prophet that he should have prisoners of war until he had made a great slaughter in the land..." Quran (8:59-60) - "And let not those who disbelieve suppose that they can outstrip (Allah's Purpose). Lo! they cannot escape. Make ready for them all thou canst of (armed) force and of horses tethered, that thereby ye may dismay the enemy of Allah and your enemy." As Ibn Kathir puts it in his tafsir on this passage, "Allah commands Muslims to prepare for war against disbelievers, as much as possible, according to affordability and availability." Quran (8:65) - "O Prophet, exhort the believers to fight..." Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them." According to this verse, the best way of staying safe from Muslim violence at the time of Muhammad was to convert to Islam: prayer (salat) and the poor tax (zakat) are among the religion's Five Pillars. The popular claim that the Quran only inspires violence within the context of self-defense is seriously challenged by this passage as well, since the Muslims to whom it was written were obviously not under attack. Had they been, then there would have been no waiting period (earlier verses make it a duty for Muslims to fight in self-defense, even during the sacred months). The historical context is Mecca after the idolaters were subjugated by Muhammad and posed no threat. Once the Muslims had power, they violently evicted those unbelievers who would not convert. [Note: The verse says to fight unbelievers "wherever you find them". Even if the context is in a time of battle (which it was not) the reading appears to sanction attacks against those "unbelievers" who are not on the battlefield. In 2016, the Islamic State referred to this verse in urging the faithful to commit terror attacks: Allah did not only command the 'fighting' of disbelievers, as if to say He only wants us to conduct frontline operations against them. Rather, He has also ordered that they be slain wherever they may be – on or off the battlefield. (source)] Quran (9:14) - "Fight against them so that Allah will punish them by your hands and disgrace them and give you victory over them and heal the breasts of a believing people." Humiliating and hurting non-believers not only has the blessing of Allah, but it is ordered as a means of carrying out his punishment and even "healing" the hearts of Muslims. Quran (9:20) - "Those who believe, and have left their homes and striven with their wealth and their lives in Allah's way are of much greater worth in Allah's sight. These are they who are triumphant." The Arabic word interpreted as "striving" in this verse is the same root as "Jihad". The context is obviously holy war. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/25/17 at 19:46:29 302E21202D302B36440 wrote:
And it's a good thing that Christians never kill infidels.... oh wait... [/quote] In the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit? Pretty darn rare. When you hear a story about a bomb going off in a subway killing dozens, no one's first thought is another Christian just blew himself up. [/quote] Yeah, just like when you hear about a lynching: http://www.thenation.com/article/lynching-university-maryland-campus/ Or a hate killing: http://www.mediamatters.org/blog/2016/11/04/white-racist-kills-two-cops-iowa-ambush-and-fox-news-goes-quiet/214294 [/quote] I know you'll dodge this question like you always do when cornered but did those guys yell in the name of jesus i kill you? No. Did a christian group call in and take responsibility? No. So what the F is your point? You really have no desire to discuss anything, you're just stiring $hit up, but at least post something relevant. Pathetic, just pathetic. I'm done with you for a while. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 20:04:35 Here ya ago PG: http://www.evilbible.com/evil-bible-home-page/murder-in-the-bible/ And some more: Ephesians 6:12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 “If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and, though they discipline him, will not listen to them, then his father and his mother shall take hold of him and bring him out to the elders of his city at the gate of the place where he lives, and they shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This our son is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.’ Then all the men of the city shall stone him to death with stones. So you shall purge the evil from your midst, and all Israel shall hear, and fear. Deuteronomy 17:1-20 “You shall not sacrifice to the Lord your God an ox or a sheep in which is a blemish, any defect whatever, for that is an abomination to the Lord your God. “If there is found among you, within any of your towns that the Lord your God is giving you, a man or woman who does what is evil in the sight of the Lord your God, in transgressing his covenant, and has gone and served other gods and worshiped them, or the sun or the moon or any of the host of heaven, which I have forbidden, and it is told you and you hear of it, then you shall inquire diligently, and if it is true and certain that such an abomination has been done in Israel, then you shall bring out to your gates that man or woman who has done this evil thing, and you shall stone that man or woman to death with stones. ... More from Deuteronomy.... Deuteronomy 13: 6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again. 12 If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in 13 that troublemakers have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods you have not known), 14 then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, 15 you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. You must destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. 16 You are to gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. That town is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt. Leviticus 20:27 “A man or a woman who is a medium or a necromancer shall surely be put to death. They shall be stoned with stones; their blood shall be upon them.” Luke 19:27 But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slaughter them before me.’” Luke 18:30 Who will not receive many times more in this time, and in the age to come eternal life.” Matthew 13:40 Just as the weeds are gathered and burned with fire, so will it be at the close of the age. Matthew 13:39 And the enemy who sowed them is the devil. The harvest is the close of the age, and the reapers are angels. Yeah... the Bible is nothing like the Quran at all..... |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by T And T Garage on 05/25/17 at 20:10:52 586A6D7C7B6A7D426E7D640F0 wrote:
Bye bye web.... |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by pg on 05/25/17 at 20:38:57 4A545B5A574A514C3E0 wrote:
The Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers for the sake of Islamic rule. Perhaps you could show me some verses where Jesus calls people to death in order to propagate Christianity. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/25/17 at 22:00:57 It's pointless. They know squat about the federal reserve and pretend that those who do are nuts. They don't know what difference it makes to argue Old Testament and pretend that That is what we practice. The arrogance and ignorance can't be countered even with facts. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by WebsterMark on 05/26/17 at 04:05:47 I don't know if TT is Beavis or Butthead but he's definitely one of them. I'm off for a long weekend. Let's hope those Christians don't send in a suicide bomber to blow up some more kids in the name of Jesus at a Katy Perry concert.... |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by oldNslow on 05/26/17 at 05:58:40 http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/05/26/egypt-attack-gunfire-on-bus-carrying-coptic-christians-kills-at-least-26.html They keep telling us this themselves. And yet some people refuse to believe them. I find that astonishing. From the story: "God gave orders to kill every infidel," one of the militants carrying an AK-47 assault rifle said in the 20-minute video." "In February, members of an ISIS affiliate released a video saying that Egyptian Christians were their "favorite prey." |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/26/17 at 06:12:07 Having good sense is not PC. |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by pg on 05/26/17 at 17:00:44 415F50515C415A47350 wrote:
Your ideology was the foundation of that killed tens of millions of innocent noncombatant citizens by their government. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_Communist_regimes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_atheism Best regards, |
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Title: Re: what's it gonna take? Post by Paraquat on 05/27/17 at 05:19:40 7A656364797E4F7F4F77656922100 wrote:
I'm reading a book called How Not to be Wrong: The Power of Mathematical thinking. It's a lot of statistics. In the middle it tells the story of how some MIT students gamed the Massachusetts lottery. It began and ended with a quote: "If gambling is exciting, you're doing it wrong" --Steve |
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