|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1527699383 Message started by justin_o_guy2 on 05/30/18 at 09:56:23 |
|
Title: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/30/18 at 09:56:23 Governor Abbott has suggested that a room be made available for cops to use for paperwork, swing by, use the bathroom, and just generally be a presence in the schools. That's a great idea. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by LostArtist on 05/30/18 at 10:02:14 37282E2934330232023A28246F5D0 wrote:
worked great in Santa Fe... oh, wait, cops were actually there, armed and everything... and yet.... Edit: although, to be fair, the kids do report that the cops drew fire from the shooter so, the victim tally would have been higher, but let's not kid ourselves and think this is a panacea and will fix everything |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/30/18 at 10:23:02 And yet what? It's not PERFECT? Seatbelts don't always save you Cops get shot Life is not fair Deal with it Is it Better To be armed and able to fight back Or Unarmed and a bullet sponge? Is it better to wear a seatbelt and have injuries lessened? You DEMAND perfection Or it's not a good answer Funny how turdacious Bamicare is and how much the same people who are against common sense gun carrying. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by LostArtist on 05/30/18 at 12:06:41 6C7375726F6859695961737F34060 wrote:
you assume too much. I'm not against that idea at all, just saying that it IS ALREADY IN PLACE in many places, and it helps but it's not any better than anything we already have. it's NOT AN ANSWER, IT'S ALREADY A REALITY. it's like you're praising Abbot for saying that the sky is blue... Edit: so darn defensive and offensive all the time... are you actually trying to convince people to be on your side???? |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/30/18 at 21:03:28 I Assume Nothing You STATED that since armed guards were THERE and Failed to avoid people being killed and wounded, in fact, some of the Professional Gun Toters were SHOT, so that PROVES more guns won't stop the problem. Do you REALLY think that one or two of these shooters dying or getting wounded before they kill their quota is gonna STOP the insanity that the Left visited upon us? WTF? Only RECENTLY have we seen publicity about any schools doing what people like me say needs done. Let the Show up shooting Get SHOT Message get out. Idiots want to pretend that because there is a new direction and it's gonna take a while for it to be completely realized it's a failure. Why are you people so unable to see what Bamicare is? |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 05/31/18 at 06:56:16 The idea is to encourage law enforcement presence at public schools. Why is this a bad idea? |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/31/18 at 08:31:49 The heck if I know. Why an immediate abandonment of the failed Signs and efforts to harden the schools isn't accepted by everyone is unbelievable. Well, maybe they are afraid of looking responsible for the death and misery caused by the program they so foolishly believed in. That's what will happen, after we start doing what should have been done, and things change, then everyone will see how stupid the signs were. Funny thing about guns. When carjacking was a pastime for armed thugs, the governor didn't have the cops arresting everyone and taking guns, he told the People Arm yourselves and fight back. And it's been a whole new ball game since. Ahh, but schools For some reason it's bad to defend the precious with guns. Huhh? That's EXACTLY HOW you defend. So WTF IS the REASON for Not wanting armed teachers and cops? It's not about REASON. It's because it's impossible to brainwash the kids into being antigun while the teacher's packing heat. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 05/31/18 at 10:17:47 "It's because it's impossible to brainwash the kids into being antigun while the teacher's packing heat." Spend a few months with high school kids discussing school shootings and you might change your mind. I don't think armed anything will alter the huge impression social media and 24/7 interconnected social structures have. This is compounded by your average teenager's natural brain chemistry to challenge and directly conflict with the principles of their primary relationships. Some US soldiers (specifically infantry and similar) are anti-gun, that should say something. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/31/18 at 11:09:28 The lefties, who own and operate most media and schools, have been pushing gun control ideas for decades. Zero tolerance, chew a pastry into a gun shape, get arrested , Idiocy, That's part of it. That soldiers are now antigun means nothing to me. They are Wrong. And a study of history and an understanding of the natural state of man will show that. Banks STILL get robbed. But you take away from them the ability to have armed guards and see how much that increases. Why is that so hard to get? Nobody sees the connection between No Gun Zone shootings? The ridiculous position that Since armed guards got Shot and the shooter Did manage to kill, OBVIOUSLY armed guards are Not the answer is so ludicrous that it's astounding. Don't wear a helmet Ride in shorts Because you can get hurt no matter what you have on, so it's stupid to dress for a crash. Why send in the Army? They don't matter. See? All the training and equipment and they still DIE. But you lefties keep on pretending that because good guys with guns got Shot, That's proof that good guys with guns is a bad idea. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/01/18 at 11:29:27 I agree signs don't stop crime, however I do not agree that armed teachers will cause 100 percent of kids to not become advocates of gun control(antigun). I'm not sure that armed teachers will very much influence their stance at all, given how children of that age assess the world around them and develop ethical standards. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by MnSpring on 06/01/18 at 13:24:09 5474767E6374110 wrote:
First, going to use the word, ’Teachers’, in this and like cases, as a Person, who is willing, understands, skilled, safe, who has or will take another level of training in firearms, and can be a, Teacher, Secretary, Principal, Assistant, Janitor, Hall walker, etc. (Which should satisfy the Panty In A Bunch Snowflakes, who will say, “OMG you want to just pass out guns to teachers”. “…I agree signs don’t stop crime…” Ah-Yea ! “…however I do not agree that armed teachers will cause 100 percent of kids to not become advocates of gun control(antigun). …” No one said, 100% will go one way of the other. YET: “…not sure that armed teachers will very much influence their stance at all…” I believe, armed ’teachers’, will cause, LESS, ‘Anti-Gun’, belief. Because, when the anti Gun Media, LIES to them, that Guns are bad’. They will not believe it, because they, know, see, experience, that Mr/Mrs Johnson, is a Nice Person, and they carry a Gun. So Guns can not be Bad, or a, nice person, would not have one. Unlike now, where they are, ’Taught’, by the Media only ONE SIDE, that, ‘Guns’ are Bad. And because NONE of their Teachers carry, Or, (in many places), even Allowed to say, “Guns are NOT bad”. They will ONLY hear ONE side. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/01/18 at 19:47:05 Thank you. Explaining what, to me, is obvious, just hurts |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by WebsterMark on 06/02/18 at 04:25:36 0424262E3324410 wrote:
That's a statement that deserves examination. Do high schoolers assess the world and develop ethical standards? What did the last couple of shooters asses and develop? If it were known, multiple teachers had weapons, police were routinely in the building, would either the Florida or Texas shootings had happened? |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by thumperclone on 06/02/18 at 06:57:10 my LA high school in the 60s had a closed campus only one way in after classes started with armed security guards on patrol today our local schools here have "community service officers" (armed police in uniform)on campus |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by MnSpring on 06/02/18 at 08:13:01 5B444245585F6E5E6E56444803310 wrote:
Sorry you had to sit through that. Sometimes it can’t be helped. Like when I was behind the counter, and answered, (With A Smile), the question: “What’s the difference between a DA and a SA” Some people are just lost, and cannot understand, you or me. Posted a simple explanation, so hopefully people who are lost, will be able to understand it. Won’t change anyones mind, (The phrase come to mind: ‘Never Mind the Facts, My Mind is Made Up’) But a least, they, may, understand it. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/04/18 at 06:41:55 "No one said, 100% will go one way of the other" It was clearly stated that it is "impossible" for kids to be anti-gun if their teachers pack heat. Impossible as I interpret it means not one student will be anti-gun if they have or had teachers carrying guns. If one decided to be anti-gun, then its possible. My assessment was that JOG believes that any student that has a teacher carrying a firearm could ever be anti gun, as it is impossible to convince one otherwise. If that's not true why state it that way? Why call it impossible. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/04/18 at 06:51:43 "That's a statement that deserves examination. Do high schoolers assess the world and develop ethical standards? What did the last couple of shooters asses and develop? If it were known, multiple teachers had weapons, police were routinely in the building, would either the Florida or Texas shootings had happened? " They assess the world around them and develop ethical standards. They do not exclusively develop those standards through the influence or observation of adults, especially today given the constant 24/7 access to other teenagers and associated trends and propaganda. It is not common, and typically has not ever been common for teenagers to emulate adult actions or activities as it is part of our pubescent brain to not do those things. There is tons of research available about the "rebellion" type behaviors teenagers typically exhibit. As for whether the last shootings would have occurred if there was armed staff and more armed law enforcement presence there is not a reliable way I know of to know. I do know that a standard risk-assessment would say yes, and that the process would change as the shooters are adaptive. When asked the high school students I have interacted with would do things like shoot into busses full of kids, or other gatherings such as sporting events, or go to a mall or concert. Arming teachers may have a chance of motivating a shooter to do it elsewhere, but typically where their peers would gather. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by WebsterMark on 06/04/18 at 06:57:04 Arming teachers may have a chance of motivating a shooter to do it elsewhere, but typically where their peers would gather. That makes logical sense, I agree that's what would happen. So where would it move to? Football games? Malls? Local hangouts? If so, would that be "better"? |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/04/18 at 07:17:48 assessment was that JOG believes that any student that has a teacher carrying a firearm could ever be anti gun, as it is impossible to convince one otherwise. You read funny |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/04/18 at 07:23:22 I think there's only two acceptable outcomes to consider mass shootings "better" A consistent reduction in casualty counts. A consistent reduction in motivated shooters. I feel that its more productive to de-motivate shooters than it is to reduce casualties when it comes to schools and students. The unfortunate circumstance is that every shooting makes the action more "normal" and easier for the next kid to perform. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/04/18 at 07:33:32 feel that its more productive to de-motivate shooters than it is to reduce casualties when it comes to schools and students. Demotivate? Can you Demotivate someone who is not identified? If we know how to Demotivate, do we know what motivates? And pasting their faces across the news and saying their names over and over is giving them their fifteen minutes.. There's no mystery about WHO did the killing in Florida. He confessed, and he Is the bad guy. Now he needs put on his knees on the town square and shot in the back of the head. That's what I call Demotivation |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/04/18 at 09:03:22 Historically public executions have done little to deter violence from the research I have read over the years. High School kids watch their friends die every day in many inner cities and it has done nothing to reduce gang activity. "Can you Demotivate someone who is not identified?" No. I do believe that the education system and mental health system can create determent methods similar to how the anti-smoking program has worked. This program does not seek to identify kids who smoke then address them, it instead addresses smoking as a whole as a negative. The program works, ignited nicotine use among youth is at an all time low, however vapes just roll in and take their place. Addressing school shootings and shooters I think can be done without creating individual student profiles and identifying them as a potential shooter. Reducing media coverage would be nice, but is not possible without a major revision in media rights, social media and phone usage. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/04/18 at 09:10:37 Reducing media coverage would be nice, but is not possible without a major revision in media rights, social media and phone You miss the point. You think I'm saying Force people to do what makes sense. Nobody said FORCE the media to be smart. When someone covers a shooting and doesn't make the shooter a momentary celebrity AND then don't suffer ratings drops Because of it Then the Market will show everyone that is a good approach. You seem to decide whether or not something can work based on whether or not people can be forced to do it. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/04/18 at 09:22:22 "When someone covers a shooting and doesn't make the shooter a momentary celebrity AND then don't suffer ratings drops Because of it Then the Market will show everyone that is a good approach." How do we get media coverage to stop distributing footage of active shooters? Also cell phones, instagram, snapchat etc. how do we discourage youth from using them to distribute information about a shooting? The whole thing to me is comparative to discouraging people from watching pornography. Good luck with that. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/04/18 at 10:45:52 How do we get media coverage to stop distributing footage of active shooters I'm sorry Let me be clear The Ongoing, constant, repetitive reporting, needs to stop. The moment it's happening, reports fly. After THAT, the MEDIA is responsible for making heroes of the idiots. They need to think about how they report on things. You seem determined that it Can't be done better That the public demands the name and picture of the maniac And without a rights crushing law The media will not start being smart. I'm SUGGESTING what I think would help Deincentivise shooters. Do you AGREE that it would be better that way? I don't care if you can SEE HOW it would ever Be that way. It's just a question. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by MnSpring on 06/04/18 at 11:22:58 4C6C6E667B6C090 wrote:
What was said was: "...It's because it's impossible to brainwash the kids into being antigun while the teacher's packing heat. ..." Makes a difference. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/04/18 at 12:16:16 I think its better if there's less media, and social media distribution of active shooters. I don't know of a way to get that to happen voluntarily. There's very little risk to reward incentive unless active shooters really step up the game. Structurally it could happen, but would be costly in implementation, and would involve removing rights. |
|
Title: Re: Heeey, Abbooot, that's a good idea Post by Eegore on 06/04/18 at 12:20:24 4D6E537072696E67000 wrote:
What was said was: "...It's because it's impossible to brainwash the kids into being antigun while the teacher's packing heat. ..." Makes a difference. [/quote] There is a difference, however I do not believe that no child could ever be "brainwashed" by my definition (we would have to define brainwash in specific parameters as it has pretty wide interpretation) if their teachers carried weapons at school. I feel it is possible for a student that was in a school with teachers carrying weapons to be coerced by psychological means to be anti-gun. If the carrying of firearms was all it took then the NRA should step up their lobbying in that direction, as in one generation all anti-gun youth would completely disappear. Since it would be impossible to convince any youth otherwise. |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |