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Message started by Arty Dodger on 09/25/24 at 16:27:01

Title: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by Arty Dodger on 09/25/24 at 16:27:01

Hi everyone,
I’m having some trouble with my 2016 Suzuki Savage and could really use some advice.
When I first got the bike, I changed the handlebars and used a different clutch cable. Unfortunately, that cable turned out to be too long, so I switched back to the original handlebars and clutch cable, replaced clutch rod with a longer one. Now, I can engage and disengage the clutch by hand, but when I start the bike and try to shift gears, it seems like the gears are skipping.

Here’s what’s happening:
-I start the bike in first gear.
-When I try to shift up, it feels like the gear lever goes all the way up and skips the gears.
-Finding neutral is very difficult; even the smallest movement with my foot changes the gears.
-When I shift from 1st to 2nd, it seems to go into 2nd, but I can’t shift any higher. It feels like something is preventing it from going into 3rd and 4th.

I haven’t taken off the left side cover yet to inspect it, but I’m wondering if the issue could be related to the foot pedal adjustment. Could it be that the clutch isn’t getting enough pressure, or maybe too much, to change the gears properly?

A lot of parts on the bike are aftermarket and custom, but the engine is still the same. I’m not sure what to do next. Should I:
-Open up the left side case to see what’s going on inside?
-Adjust the foot linkage (I think I tried this already)?

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 09/25/24 at 16:57:39

Open the RIGHT side crankcase cover (rear brake side of the bike). That's where the clutch lives. The left side (gear shifter side) reveals the alternator and starting gears. I think you just mixed that up since you replaced the clutch rod. I'm assuming you are referring to the clutch push rod that slides into the release plate. ???

Can you take a pic of the gear shifter assembly? It may be improperly aligned.

What is a foot pedal adjustment? Never heard this... Do you mean the external gear shifter assembly? The footpegs are attached to the frame brackets.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by verslagen1 on 09/25/24 at 19:24:36

283B3D302D262D2E2C3B490 wrote:

Here’s what’s happening:
-I start the bike in first gear.

try starting in neutral, easier to find when off.

Quote:

-When I try to shift up, it feels like the gear lever goes all the way up and skips the gears.

can't be done, gears only shift 1 at a time. You can skip n, but not 2 gears, just not enough teeth on the shift mechanism.

Quote:

-Finding neutral is very difficult; even the smallest movement with my foot changes the gears.

Probably bad adjustment of the shift lever

Quote:

-When I shift from 1st to 2nd, it seems to go into 2nd, but I can’t shift any higher. It feels like something is preventing it from going into 3rd and 4th.

If your lever position is too far 1 way or another, it won't shift right.

the shift lever should point straight down.

next thing I think happened is you put in a longer shift rod, maybe it's too long.
look at the markings on the side of the case and compare with the clutch lever, the clutch lever should be in the middle.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by badwolf on 09/25/24 at 20:39:13

Sounds like the shifting rod is hitting the bottom of the left side case. On most bikes to change the positon of the shifter you move the shifter on the spline that comes out of the case, not so with the S40. If you move the shifter linkage on the spline the rod willl hit the case and you will have trouble. There should be a punch mark on the splined shaft and the linkage that goes on it. LINE THEM UP. To move the shifter adjust the length of the rod.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 09/26/24 at 05:28:22

Great input guys! Good details!

Badwolf - Great explanation on how to make the adjustment! I did it wrong the first time I adjusted mine until someone pointed out I was making the adjustment in the wrong place.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ohiomoto on 09/26/24 at 17:27:20

Make sure the shift linkage is straight.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by Surviving Philly on 09/28/24 at 08:48:54

Why did you put the longer rod in? It sounds like the clutch is not fully disengaging, which causes the issues with shifting you're describing.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 09/29/24 at 05:04:14

Because she said so!! Because installing a shorter rod seems inadequate?! Because a longer rod is always better?! If your current rod isn’t doing the trick, you need a bigger rod?’

Forget any technical bulletins or engineering - it needs a longer rod!

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by JOG on 09/29/24 at 07:19:57

Bring out the longer rods!

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 09/29/24 at 10:29:08

5D687B63787F7B687E1A0 wrote:

Bring out the longer rods!

;D ;D :o

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by Arty Dodger on 10/01/24 at 08:56:01

Thanks for the explanation. Here's a photo of the shifter arm and linkage. With it in neutral, the position is not entirely straight up and down so that might be the issue?

I put a longer rod in it because I tried to put a longer handlebar on it which needed to replace the clutch cable. Then the piece where the clutch cable adjustments that's attached to the engine broke off, so I fixed the issue. But it wouldn't disengage when pressed in. Changing to a longer rod seemed to fix that issue. Then I moved back to my old handlebars,but didn't change back the rod length. Maybe if I change back the rod and adjust the lever, then hopefully that'll fix it.
---------------------------------------------------------------------

3F2C3B3A25282E2C2778490 wrote:

[quote author=283B3D302D262D2E2C3B490 link=1727306821/0#0 date=1727306821]
Here’s what’s happening:
-I start the bike in first gear.

try starting in neutral, easier to find when off.

Quote:

-When I try to shift up, it feels like the gear lever goes all the way up and skips the gears.

can't be done, gears only shift 1 at a time. You can skip n, but not 2 gears, just not enough teeth on the shift mechanism.

Quote:

-Finding neutral is very difficult; even the smallest movement with my foot changes the gears.

Probably bad adjustment of the shift lever

Quote:

-When I shift from 1st to 2nd, it seems to go into 2nd, but I can’t shift any higher. It feels like something is preventing it from going into 3rd and 4th.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by verslagen1 on 10/01/24 at 09:55:01

4556505D404B40434156240 wrote:

Thanks for the explanation. Here's a photo of the shifter arm and linkage. With it in neutral, the position is not entirely straight up and down so that might be the issue?

yes, I believe that's a part of your shifting issue.
you might notice that there's a mark on the end of the shaft that can be used to align the lever, just move the split in the lever with it.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 10/01/24 at 15:10:50

Here’s a pic of mine with the bike in neutral. My bike shifts fine. The rod is slightly higher where it connects up front (slightly lower at the splined shaft).

It looks like we're only maybe 1-2 splines different. It must be your longer rod. I have an average normal length rod.

Verslagen - Maybe I’m old and blind, but I don’t see an index mark on the end of the splined shaft. Somebody schooled me to get the rod level and make any adjustment up front and not at the splined shaft. But you obviously need to have it right at the splined shaft. Where is this elusive index mark? Maybe I need to be more like Dave and clean it up! ;)

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by verslagen1 on 10/01/24 at 16:53:16

I see something that might be a mark, use your phone as a magnifier.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 10/01/24 at 17:19:32

Don't make me go out in the garage and clean it! Believe me, I tried zooming in and I still don't see it!

I believe you! Bad eyes! Bifocals needs a 10X upgrade!

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 10/01/24 at 17:42:55

Cleaned, zoomed, lighted, cropped…I still can’t see no index mark. I’m blind!

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ohiomoto on 10/01/24 at 18:47:37

5C5E4D534D4F575E564D3F0 wrote:

--------------------

This: ^^^

And, it looks like the shift linkage could be bent. It needs to be straight or it could break. It happened to my bike. The shifting got mushy, I couldn't get into 1st gear or neutral, and the linkage snapped.

Thankfully, the bike was in second gear and I wasn't far from home.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by badwolf on 10/01/24 at 20:19:01

Blowing up both pics, the arms look the same. The rod however is closer to the case on the black bike. Most likly bent, or something modified on the front end.
Get down close and have someone else shift it. (engine off) It will be hitting the case. You should see marks in the paint on the case.
Take the whole assy off and look for a bent rod, and post a pic.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by Arty Dodger on 10/02/24 at 07:05:28

I saw the little mark on the side of the spline and seems to be right. I took a photo of the placement of the shift lever and it's in between the two marks. I can try to change back the shorter rod and see if that fixes it.

Changing the angle of the shifter linkage didn't really help and It's really hard to put it in gear. I have to put alot of force on the foot lever in order to shift. But I also still don't feel the shifting from 2nd and on.

Sure didn't want to have to drain the oil again.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by badwolf on 10/02/24 at 21:23:43

Arty, You are looking at 2 different things here. Monkeying with the clutch adjustment is NOT going to fix a shifting issue. Once you are moving you should be able to shift up and down without touching the clutch lever, it won't be smooth, but the bike will do it. I have ridden 60 miles home with a broken clutch cable, had to come to a dead stop 3 times. Wasn't pretty, but I made it.
A shifting issue is a shifting issue,
A clutch issue is a clutch issue.
If you can start the bike pull in the clutch and put in gear, any gear, and hold the clutch in and the bike does not move, the clutch is disengaging.
If you let the clutch out and the bike moves, the clutch is engaging.
That is enough to tell you the clutch is good enough to ride the bike.
Not shifting is a different thing totaly. Either your linkage is messed up or,,,,,,, you have internal tranny issues, they make loud noises and poke holes in the cases.
I still think the shifting linkage rod is hitting the case.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ohiomoto on 10/03/24 at 05:45:27

The OEM grear shift rod (https://www.partzilla.com/product/suzuki/25525-21E50?ref=d6fc8630b13b4f44e34749abdd3e215e1bd852ad) needs to be straight and properly adjusted.

http://https://c3cycle.com/cdn/shop/products/256237011445-6.jpg?v=1697459984&width=1200
Shift linkage rod

http://https://c3cycle.com/cdn/shop/products/266536461847-0.jpg?v=1701223475&width=800
Bent shift rod

http://https://suzukisavage.com/yabb2.2/Attachments/image_078_001.jpg
Broken rod

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by Arty Dodger on 10/03/24 at 06:41:43

So I put back the standard clutch pin, but the bike is still hard to shift. It's almost like it just skips 2-4 gear. I can hear a click on each gear, but the click is light and definately can't control it with my foot.

I've straightened the rod, but it seems to be still bending so I guess I need to replace that.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ohiomoto on 10/03/24 at 11:03:27

If the rod is flexing, bending, and out of adjustment, it's probably the issue.

I would remove the rod and confirm the bike will shift gears before replacing it. You can use a wrench for extra leverage and you may have to roll the bike forward to get the gear to engage.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by Arty Dodger on 10/18/24 at 14:41:11

Ok guys….I figured it out and I feel so so stupid. [ch129318][ch8205][ch9794][ch65039]

Turns out the clip and washer to the lever fell off at some point and water and junk got all up in it. Hammered that sucker off ( I had to beat that lever hard), cleaned, lubed, and installed. Now she’s easy to move and hooked right back up. Voila!

Now just need to install it to my bike and test her out. But I’m pretttttyyy sure this fixed my issue.

But hey, I don’t claim to be smort [ch129299]

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by Surviving Philly on 10/18/24 at 15:05:10

Some bikes don't have the mark -- my 2013 doesn't. It's annoying.

Title: Re: Savage Trans/Clutch Issue
Post by ThumperPaul on 10/19/24 at 05:13:22

6B5A4E575554575A553B0 wrote:

Some bikes don't have the mark -- my 2013 doesn't. It's annoying.

Thanks for chiming in. My ‘06 doesn’t have an index mark either. Just gotta eyeball it level and make sure it isn’t smacking the case.

Arty Dodger - not sure what clip and washer you are referring to. Hopefully it solves the problem.