Ah, my caretaker, the Feng Shui dragon spirit that always rides on my pillion behind me, she is obviously contemplating an act of advanced reloading again.  

We always give the Feng Shui kitty lots of time to contemplate the various choices involved with bullets and powders, etc. and go with the ying/yang balance that gives the most expansion and penetration.  

In this case pure SPEED isn't the answer -- speed ends up with shallow penetration and a fragmented bullet.

Why is this here on the WD thread?    (hint:  it is a shoot 'n scoot, right?)

Well now, we have several miraculous coincidences that occur when you sort out people according to their passions and one of these coincidences is that all the "at speed" Dragon Riders this year, Dave MM and I, we all own the same little pistol, of which two of the three of us have  played around with boring and stroking the little jewel a bit.

So, it is a pistol of interest to the Dragon Riders as we all picked it out of the world of pocket pistols.

So, why the cut down 30 carbine case?  Pppppppressure, of course.  The 32 acp harkens back to blackpowder days and has a SAMMI max of 18,000 cup which isn't beans compared to the lock up strength of the P-32 pistol.   The 30 carbine had a stock pressure level of 38,000 cup which is more in the working range we are interested in.

Now MM can tell you what happens if you put a lot of extra pressure inside a stock 32 acp case and you don't do anything to handle the resulting slide slamming action.

My gun was put together at the same time MouseMag32 and GoldenLoki did the original MouseMag development (back when the guns first came out) and mine is identical to Mouse's gun in its construction.   Extended recoil housing for longer recoil action and the nested triple recoil springs as per Mouse's recipe.  My magazine follower is more like Golden's than Mouse's as Golden's worked more reliably and still allowed you a carry capacity of 4 in the mag with one up the tube.

Since both Mouse and Golden have gone silent on us (RIP on Mouse, Golden has just gotten too old on us) I suspect mine is the last of the original 32 Mouse Magums that is still working.   This is to be expected as Keltec sells a .380 little pistol and a 9mm little pistol now and there is no need for the 32 AutoMagnums any more.

Golden's posted gel testing at the time showed 14" of penetration and .48" expanded petals using the Hornaday 90 grain bullet so I am looking to see what can be done using the new Hornaday 100 grain XTP and some of the newer slower powders to perhaps get some additional penetration depth at a somewhat slower launch speed, along the lines of the FBI's 147 grain 9mm load.  

The issue with the 32 acp is to get all the way through the vitals and penetrate into the spine, something that only 32 ball ammo can currently reliably do.  

Of course the wound cavity left with ball ammo that small isn't anything really incapacitating, so you can see why some additional Fung Shui kitty thought has been required on this complex and puzzling issue.   It is a real balancing act between slower powders, case capacity and bullet seating depth.  

Plus the resulting recoil has to knock the slide all the way back, which is something that isn't always that easy to do on a triple springed MouseMag32 set up.



I am also going to cook me something up with the Sierra 90 grain slug, as it has a shorter shoulder to meplat distance and it may allow more powder capacity than any of the original 90 grain bullets had to offer.


Plus, Power Pistol powder didn't exist back then .... and it does well in small cases making big power in those smaller amounts.


  time to play with some old toys again .....

Well OldFeller  at the loading bench ... I'll bring some of the loads that broke the barrel on my p32 and see if Mr. 3 springs will even cycle with them ???    I'm not sure what presure they run at but its the Lee 90 gr SWC mold cut down to make a 71 gr. SWC  then loaded with HS-6 to make the little gun bounce about all I want in that small of a pistol.    I have the amount of HS-6 noted somewhere but I'll have to "Hunt-it-up".  

I have a 32mag-4inch (S+W...? 63 ?) that I load the 77 gr ranchDog for , and have found that the AutoComp powder works great in .!  Its a "J" frame and without going over presure its posible to load hot enough to couse wrist problems ,   makes me wonder "Why the 327 mag. was even needed ??? shorter barrels ????     I have a Davis 2 shot Deringer made for 32ACP but recut for 32 H+R Mag , it will jump out of your hand with the Mags in it , so it gets fed 32 S+W Longs just a little on the Hot side ...     Anyway getting back to the AutoComp .. it will remind ya of H-110 or WW296  but a lot finer gr. burns nice and clean.

I'm guessing your looking at the AutoComp too ?

My wife just notice the gummy worm change lump that I had put out for her to find.

Gummy worm change lump?   Whuzzat?

Well now, let's go back in time a bit --- to 18 to 20 years ago to when I used to take trips down the Little River in an aluminum boat with some of my Pals (AWANA church group boys).   On the last one of those trips we got a heavy thunderstorm which threw the little cricklike Little River into full flood, which made the aluminum boat uncontrollable (it was like riding a pinball machine, bouncing off of bushes and trees and all, sometimes in the channel but most times out of the banks.

We aborted after playing pinball for a bit and pulled the boat out of the water, walked the 150 yards to the road that parallels the Little River and stuck our thumb out for a ride to the nearest country store.

We got there all covered in slimey river gook and broken tree branch twigs and smelling like the bilgewater in the bottom of the boat.   NO money, no wallet on me, no nothing on us for ID.    2 big bums and three little bums in desperate need of a shower.

We were obviously "needy" so the folks in the store were generous and gave us some dollars and some change so we could all get a drink and the folks running the store let me call the wife to come get us.   Then we went out on the grass median in front of the store and promptly took a nap until the wife got there.    We wuz beat, for shure.

The remainder of the loose change wound up in the tackle box, where it got slathered with melted plastic bass worms and some structural material from the box itself along with miscellaneous fish hooks and lead shot weights, etc.    20 years of getting tossed around and decomposing and recomposting made a wad out of it all.

Sorta looks like a cat ate everything it found in the bottom of the tackle box and then horked it back up in a slimy kitty pile .....

Plan backfired a bit on me, now my wife wants to take one of the cats to the vet for X rays as the fish hooks have her all concerned for tearing up the cat's stomach as this one cat is stupid enough to have actually done it for real.

.... and the residue streaks from the red plastic worms mixed with the green plastic worms sorta looks like bloody stool jest a little bit .....

 
What do you mean it's only a cat?   Unbeliever !!  Heretic !!

Oh, mistress of the pillion seat, forgive MM for his disbelief, and please continue to protect me from the Dragon with your steely gaze and sharp claws ,,,,  give me aid in my reloading efforts to achieve my goals and to still keep my pistol and my hand in one piece.

The Dragon and the Feng Shui have a lot in common actually.  Both are mystical beasts with magical fangs and big claws who show a lot of attitude at times.   Feng Shui don't allow anybody to mess with their people though and although the Dragon is a lot bigger, he respects that.  

Even a full grown male Dragon has better sense than to piss off a female Feng Shui ....   she'd turn his luck around on him in a heartbeat and beat him over the head with it for weeks & weeks & weeks.

You might want to keep that in mind MM, before you go round start'n dissin' the kitty.


===========


And now, for your viewing pleasure --- acts of reloading



Building the 32MouseMag (or 32 Automag as some like to call it since Mouse went and died on us) is a fairly long process of cutting off on a lathe, beveling and expanding the ID in two different steps.  The result is a case that can take 38,000 cup in theory, in practice you don't want to guppy belly the brass over the unsupported ramp in the P32 all that much.

Building 250 custom cases takes a good bit more time than you would think it would, actually.   Makes the actual loading time seem "too quick".

"Some" reloading info for the case and for the heavier bullets (90 grain and 100 grain) is available, just look under 32 H&R Magnum in your reloading books for powder selection rankings.   Taking their help in sorting out the powders helps as you CAN put those loads into the larger diameter 30 carbine brass, then you can ladder your way up to a mixture of slide lock back and velocity that makes you happy.

Just don't expect to get those big velocities out of a 2" barrel gun.  You get more than you'd expect as you have no gap losses to contend with but you will be blowing a great deal of burning powder granules out of the 2" barrel when doing so.  

AA#7 is a flash suppressed powder, so the overblast will be a dull orange ball of fire and since you won't be looking down the barrel in most scenarios some overblast is OK -- it has some intimidation factor and on those close contact-type shots overblast can be devastating in its own right.  

A observer would not think you were popping with a 32 caliber mouse gun in any case -- the noise and blast would lead them to think you were really armed with something more significant.

Pressure is safe though, as the AA#7 loads you see listed will boost the heavy 100 grain slug up to velocity at relatively low 22,000 cup pressures.  (Got to love them Lee Sr. manuals as he lists the pressures for each load and nobody else does)  You can't blow up the gun because you can't put enough AA#7 in there to do it.

Power Pistol is a different story.  It will mostly burn in a 2" barrel.  YOU CAN do overcharges in this case with Power Pistol.   Pressures run a lot higher for the velocity achieved, too.  Not my first pick of the litter, so I will increment up with AA#7 first to see if I can get 1,000 plus fps out of it.

   but it is fun to do stuff like this, you know


I'm on the hunt for a majic load for my Contender 14" 222 Rem. now.   Its got an extra 5" of flash suppressor welded to it so its sholder-stock legal.   Should be a tack driver ... and it is with jacked bullets .... but .... I like to mold my own !  

so far 10 gr of H-4227 and that Bator bullet is the best combo (3"/100yds) thats what the scope is set for now.    The Bator looses speed quick  so I got a RBCS 60gr. pointed bullet mold I'm expermenting with now.    To much case capacity I think ... next experment is with bulkky powder .   I've tried IMR-4198 from 14grs to 18grs.     TrailBoss or Varget  is next .

I may or may not ever find the right combo to make the 60gr bullet work but I'm enjoying looking for it.  

Hay WD

I've got a Rem old army with 8"  and target sights  maby I should bring it in Sept.  its a fun gun to shoot !   I'll bet that Ruger is too !    You burning "777" ?

Yep

I was supprised at the power level these old type guns have.   I'm shooting  30 Grs FFF of 777 behind a 200 cast projectile lubed with lee alox.    
Shoots just fine but its a bugger to get apart after a few shots.   Its' the Stainless target modle from Dixie-Gun-Works  up in Union City.

I shot a deer with it once ,  seen the deer comming and ran ahead to set-up an ambush point.    Sure enough 20 min. later here they came.  They got to a point 72 paces from me when the lead doe smelled me , I know couse she piled up where she stood when that 200 grs. broke her neck.   I did have good cover and a slight uphill shot from a prone pistion working in my favor.    Well the bullet didn't exit but did allmost make it to the skin on the far side .   I guess the neck bone slowed it down quite a bit.

I have shot the .451 jacked bullets made for the acp but the pure lead is more accurate.   The Remington cylinders are close enougth to 451 the jackets stay where they're put.    If you have figured a way to keep fowlling from locking things up after 10 or 12 rounds I'd like to see how ya do it.

Oldfeller--FSO wrote on 06/27/13 at 11:45:58:


I am just watching the discussion......aint nobody mentioned a motorcycle in days.
Am I the only one bring a bike?
I hate to be the only moving target within range !