See this entire post proves the initial question. Society can not even define what an assault wheapon is...how are they going to ban them? You do not solve the problem of evil in society by prevnting people the right to defend themselves from the evil. ( in a matter that best suits them ).

England banned guns. The murder rate did not go down but the method people use to kill have become much more brutal.

I think it was in New York where recently the Anti-gun reporter released the names of all those in town which were registered gun owners (this was suppose to hurt gun owners?) I wish someone local would do that so the criminals would know not to come to my house. If I was a criminal I would want to have that info.

Sorry, I know this will stir up more debate but I do not understand why we put our children in a place where the bad guys know they will not be defended. WE need to defend our children!

I have several police officer friends and they all tell me the same thing. Get a gun, we won't be there until it is over.

MShipley wrote on 12/27/12 at 10:44:24:


I am not talking about getitng rid of guns. Heck I may even be putting more guns on the street.
This is the basic idea.
Guns that wont fire unless in the authorised users hand. Fingerprint id based trigger lock.
Guns that use bullets different from all the ones that are in circulation. Say a 11.5mm or a 8mm some like that.
Bullets and guns that will require a background check to buy - You are a law abiding citizen you wont have any issues. You want that dont you ?

The current open guns will be traded for a similar finger print based one in the same type. I mean a glock will be traded straight across for a glock that uses an 8mm bullet and wont fire unless its in your hand. Heck, fire the glock till you dont have bullets for it anymore, then swap it for a similar fingerprint based one.

That should in short order (few months if you want to be optimistic) get rid of all the Adam Lanza's gun packing momma's guns that could have been comandeered by him. It also does not touch the home invasion protection idea 1 bit. So the open fire guns that do exist out there now, will be left bulletless unless you make their bullets.

That should in short order do everything guns do now, and do nothing they are not supposed to.
Oh yea, the fingerprint ID mechanism may fail, I agree, however in a home invasion situation, you would 99% of the time, not fire it. A non ID  gun can jam too, so that makes for nothing better than now.

Cops dont want a gun that has any extra failure possibility. I'd say, cops, soldiers etc can use the open fire guns. There the gun does get shot.

Cool.
Srinath.

srinath, I certainly dont have an answer to the issue. I would throw a list of problems I see with your view. I have several guns, why, for the same reasons I have several bikes. I like them they are fun. And like big bikes big guns offer a certain level of interest along with the danger. I dont want to trade mine in and get several of the same guns. Personally I like my shotgun for home defense. (if people saw it they would be scared). But that doesn't make it any more dangerous than any other gun. Who would pay for all these guns that are getting turned in and I still dont think a felon is going to take his illegal gun down and turn it in and he's the guy I am worried about.

These mass killings are a social phenomina that I don't think you can legislate away. One of the issues is our culture, we just want to pass some law so we feel as if we have accomplished something so we can go home and isolate ourselves in our little safe worlds and forget about it.

We attack the obvious "assault weapons" but they are not typically the weapon of choice for these people.

The breakdown of families, moral values, the value of life has just become so cheap in our country. When HS students were polled for what they wanted to be when they grow up the number one answer was "famous" and it seems that each of these people are trying to out do the other so that they feel special somehow.

I am not aginst reasonable gun control. I just dont think passing more laws will help anything. How many laws did this guy break. I dont think he cared. What if instead he caried 5 molotov coctails in the room, would that somehow be better.

PS, Ed, I love the forward controls...........

Anybody in this country can buy the ingredients and assemble a pipe bomb that that would destroy 2 or 3 classrooms. Mental health, drugs and pedophiles are the cause. Oulawing a gun with a plastic stock and a pistol grip isnt going to solve anything.

Greg wrote on 12/27/12 at 14:01:23:


A first step will be to stop mentioning the killers names. They should know they will die in ignominy and anonymity. I would actually not even bury them. They get cremated, and the state will hold onto their ashes for 75 years in a ziploc baggie with a number on it.

The second step, yes I understand its a psychologic issue, but correcting that will take a lot of expense and time - years and years.

Gun control imposed world wide (thanks ed. l) and yea good luck getting russkies to go along, there is 30 million AK 47's running around apparently mostly in asia and africa ... anyway, AK47's on us soil have been extremely rare, anyway people are not going to spray 300 bullets into a crowd of no body's when they had to make each of those, and get this, how many people will a psychotic loner have to get in touch with to make 300 bullets without the govt finding out.

Right now, he can walk into walmart and buy it.

Cool.
Srinath.

[quote][A first step will be to stop mentioning the killers names. They should know they will die in ignominy and anonymity. I would actually not even bury them. They get cremated, and the state will hold onto their ashes for 75 years in a ziploc baggie with a number on it.
/quote]

I agree with you 100% here. We have to take the fame out of it.

Serowbot wrote on 12/27/12 at 10:40:51:


1. The swiss have a close to 45% gun ownership rate, cos its only men who own guns after being released from service. The US OTOH has closer to 50%, cos there are a good many non citizens who own guns. Since a non citizen can go on a killing spree like the VA tech guy, its perfectly valid to count that in ... OK Its not 50%, but its a bit higher than 40%
2. Gun violence went up immediately after ... gun controls dont have an immediate effect, and they dont work if you have porus borders, and the one country that has enacted strict laws, and have secure borders - australia has seen a huge drop in gun crime. However US borders are far from as secure as australia. cant beat 1000 miles of ocean under any circumstances with a line in the sand.
3. The cities with the strictest gun laws also have the hugest black market in guns, NYC for example, a huge number of guns in NY are black market guns brought in from SC or GA - I know, cos I live next door to SC, and I know people who take cigarettes and guns to NY cos they can sell em for 10X more. More porus borders @ work there.
4. Mexico - nice you pointed out the Border towns ? That is american guns bought in the US in the hands of drug lords. AKA criminals killing other criminals as well as cops and citizens who get in their way with US sold guns, to control drug smuggling routes to the US. Nice, get the people/cops out of the way and really I dont see a downside. let the lowlifes kill each other ... we are fine with that. You been to other parts of mexico ? non border towns ? Yea, I have - pretty pleasant, if you like West texas.

Cherry picking information to support gun ownership - so done, 150 years of the NRA man.

You remember there was this fool who was selling some sheiete on TV about how 1 stock has gone up on this date 30 of the last 40 years and this other one went up 15 of the last 17 and this and that. Yea BS, it all needs to be same time frame ... not 12 here, 25 there, 9 there and 50 in another ...

Seriously, its gonna take decades, and then 10 years later we need to remember the events that caused us to take these actions, we could easily slide back, man we banned all this, and did all this Rf-ID bs and spend billions on psych tests for people and look, nothing is happening and reverse course.

Cool.
Srinath.

srinath wrote on 12/27/12 at 15:59:30:


I don't know. Someone walked into a gun with two pistols that was later transformed into an AR.

A pipe bomb could be made about the size of a soda can.

You have to give Sears or Lowes or whomever a copy of your CT driver's license here to get fertilizer.

I get where you want to go with your oddball caliber change but there is too much out there for reloading supplies.
Also HOW DARE YOU! Why should I have to bend my will? Why should I have to change my ways because YOU are afraid? Why will YOUR decision affect ME and make ME change what I've done for years just to accomodate YOUR needs?
This psycho made a decision that now affects hundreds of people. I could argue that the decision YOU want to make ALSO affects hundreds of people now making you no better than him.

(Nothing against you personally. Really and honestly... but when I ran through it in my head and went over all the places I wanted to add emphasis I felt it needed a personal touch. I enjoy the friendly debate we're having here with everyone.)


--Steve