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In a  Right world (Read 298 times)
MnSpring
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #30 - 01/26/25 at 14:05:52
 
Didn't do it intently.
     However.

It looks like you DID READ it.

Unlike "Such an audacious claim" first post !


Just for you, here is a third time,
   Just for you



Windmills, and the very vast amount of photovoltaic,
are nothing but a scam.

They have nothing to do with,
saving the planet’.

They BOTH, cost MORE to, Manufacture/Install/Fix/Maintain/Replace,
then they can EVER make !
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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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thumperclone
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #31 - 01/26/25 at 17:32:01
 
NOT FACTUAL they both have pay back
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Eegore
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #32 - 01/26/25 at 18:22:17
 

 Solar used to be up for debate but the manufacturing cost has gone down so much, and there are enough still producing that the production is finally under-cost.

 Unless... you calculate in the batteries.
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thumperclone
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #33 - 01/27/25 at 05:24:53
 
2 types of solar systems
grid tied [no batteries]
stand-alone[batteries]
grid tied has a quicker pay back and may have incentives and/or tax breaks depending on the utility company
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #34 - 01/27/25 at 06:56:52
 
Eegore wrote on 01/26/25 at 18:22:17:
 Solar used to be up for debate but the manufacturing cost has gone down so much, and there are enough still producing that the production is finally under-cost.

 Unless... you calculate in the batteries.


In another life, I think it’s been 18 years ago, I work for a company that supplied key materials for energy storage systems under development. Two of the systems were the leading candidates at the time. I did a lot of studying up on energy storage and was fortunate enough to travel to Japan to discuss supplying our key product line and also to another technology located in Vancouver.

18 years later, these are very minor niche suppliers in the energy storage system today. Energy storage in the size needed to make solar and wind a regular part of the energy grid do not exist at this point economically and people have been working on this for two or three decades with no success.
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speed of dark?

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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #35 - 01/27/25 at 07:30:00
 
Demand drives innovation
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Ludicrous Speed !... ... Huh...
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MnSpring
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #36 - 01/27/25 at 07:57:59
 
thumperclone wrote on 01/26/25 at 17:32:01:
NOT FACTUAL they both have pay back


Please tell all of us,
What is the cost :

To take down Windmill blades ?
To cut them up to size to transport on the road ?
To dig a HUDGE hole in the ground to place them ?,  
    (Because they can NOT BE RECYCLED)
Why in the, ‘windmill farms’, 40 to 50 % are NOT Moving ?
Why, 10% are BLACK from fire “
How many GALLONS of oil it takes to run them ?
Where does that OIL come from ?
What is the cost to remove photovoltaic panels ?
   (Which are classed as,  “ hazardous waste”, MATERIAL ?)
“If a solar panel will be disposed, the generator must make a hazardous waste determination and, if the panel is hazardous, it must be managed under the hazardous waste requirements in 40 CFR Parts 262 through 268.’
“solar panels are not covered by the shredded circuit board exclusion to the definition of solid waste’
“shredded and put into a product that is placed on the land) would be considered a solid waste,’


And on and on and on and on.

All of the, still Experimental, solar/wind creation of elect,
            Is STILL NOT, a viable option,
      Perhaps someday it will be,
 BUT  NOT  TODAY  !!!!!!!




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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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WebsterMark
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #37 - 01/27/25 at 08:31:30
 
Serowbot wrote on 01/27/25 at 07:30:00:
Demand drives innovation


I agree, necessity is the mother of invention. There’s plenty of demand.
But there are certain physical laws we can’t easily get around and energy storage is stuck right now. They’re working very hard but they’ve made only incremental progress. Elon Musk swears his batteries good work but plenty of other people have use simple math to show that that’s a dream, it can’t work. The cost would be prohibitive. That’s why big data center companies are investing in small modular nuclear reactors because it’s proven technology and with a few tweaks they can make it work for those facilities.
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thumperclone
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #38 - 01/27/25 at 08:45:18
 
it was 66 years from the first powered flight to the first moon landing
innovation takes time
todays I want it now mentality needs patience
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MnSpring
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #39 - 01/27/25 at 09:00:10
 
thumperclone wrote on 01/27/25 at 08:45:18:
" it was 66 years from the first powered flight to the first moon landing. innovation takes time ..."


ABSOLUTELY , and Solar/Wind,
           are,
  NOT THEIR YET !!!

thumperclone wrote on 01/27/25 at 08:45:18:
"... todays I want it now mentality needs patience "


What the 'F',
did  Harris  say that ????????


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Ben Franklin once said: "If you give up a freedom, for the sake of security, you will have neither".
Which is More TRUE, today, than yesterday.('06, S-40, Stock) well, mostly .
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #40 - 01/27/25 at 09:46:09
 
Serowbot wrote on 01/27/25 at 07:30:00:
Demand drives innovation



That is true. However, for government to Decide for the people that they Will develop the technology and the people pay for it WHILE it is inefficient and in many ways Counter To the Stated Purpose FOR the change, namely, being good for the environment, that is not how things are supposed to be. All the mining, the particular elements, it's Not even close. The toxic crap that is in the windmills and solar panels is problematic.
Add all of that to the Very debatable Need for the whole Green movement and I don't agree with any of it.
If someone sees a market and they can develop and provide a product, great, go for it.
For the goobs to demand it?
Pound sand.
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #41 - 01/27/25 at 12:19:24
 
thumperclone wrote on 01/27/25 at 08:45:18:
it was 66 years from the first powered flight to the first moon landing
innovation takes time
todays I want it now mentality needs patience


And how long from the moon landing until we got to Mars? At least 50 years.

That’s what I mean by technology can make great gains early on, but then the law of diminishing returns always comes in the play, and it gets more and more difficult. We made great technological leaps in energy storage early on, but then like everything, each increase gets incrementally more difficult.

Unless there’s some kind of absolutely amazing, stunning development, sufficient energy storage is likely to be prohibitively expensive making it from a practical point of view, not a viable solution. They’ve been working on this for long before I dabbled in it so I’m guessing 25 or 35 years? Look how long we’ve been trying to make an electric car viable enough to replace gas engines. They’re not there yet. Realistically speaking maybe not even a fourth or a half of the way there at best.
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #42 - 01/27/25 at 12:41:19
 
todays I want it now mentality needs patience

EXACTLY!
The Goobs and the Leftards need to Siddown, Shaddup and ALLOW THE MARKET to develop. Demanding the technology BE  is wrong..
Thank YOU for seeing that.
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #43 - 01/28/25 at 03:43:13
 
Part of this is because fewer and fewer people understand how the sausage is actually made when it comes to mechanical devices. They have absolutely no idea.

And throw in a little hyper partisanship when it comes to green energy, climate, change, NetZero, etc. and then you get these pie in the sky dreams. New York still thinks it’s going to be 100% NetZero green energy by something like 2050 or something. that’s never going to happen.
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Re: In a  Right world
Reply #44 - 01/28/25 at 03:46:39
 
Here’s a perfect example of what I just typed. I clicked over to real clear energy and there was this article about a big salmon and avocado. Left us would just as soon Africans create energy by using pedal power generators or some thing. I think the time has come for Africa to say enough.

“Later this month, African leaders and policymakers will gather at Dar es Salaam, Tanzania – East Africa’s most populous city – for the highly anticipated “Mission 300 Africa Energy Summit.”

Mission 300 is an initiative to provide electricity to 300 million Africans by 2030. Success would have profound implications for a continent that has more than 600 million lacking basic access to electricity and millions more with unreliable power supplies that stifle economic development.

However, summit supporters – the World Bank and African Development Bank – have opposed fossil fuel projects in the recent past. Meeting the Mission 300 objective will require Africa’s heads of state to be bold – and unyielding – in pressing their intentions to utilize hydrocarbons to generate electricity.

Africa’s Time to Prosper

For too long, African nations have been caught between climate commitments that discourage the use of fossil fuels and a desperate need for the reliable energy that coal, oil and natural gas provide.

The time has come for African leaders to unapologetically embrace their natural resources and chart a course that prioritizes citizens' needs over a vacuous international agenda based on pseudoscience and power politics.”

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