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Rev Limiter (Read 114 times)
FinnHammer
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Re: Rev Limiter
Reply #15 - 06/12/25 at 22:49:24
 
Axman,

First of all, cudos for finding and actually reading that Scribd manual, nice find.
The ignitor module is not a CDI. (Capacitor Discharge Ignition)
If it was it would have an output charge which could be dumped into a suitable ignition coil. A CDI actually consumes power because it supplies power to the coil at high voltage. It has a high voltage generator built in.

Instead, it is a TAI (Transistor Amplifier/Assisted Ignition)
This system acts like any oldfasioned breaker points system, except that the breakers are substituted by a transistor, which acts like the switch.
Therefore this system has a very low power draw, probably in the milliampere region.
There iis a block diagram in the haynes manual, I will post it in the next answer to this thread, it shows how the transistor functions as an open emitter.
Interesting to me is the lack of a snubber capacitor. It is present in the points breaker ignitions, usually for the reason of reducing sparke on the breaker points, but it has the added effect that when the points open, the ignition coil is connected to ground via the caapacitor. therefore cap and coil form an RC ressonant circuit which has a ressonant frequency, by which the voltage rings down, producing an oscillatory spark of relatively long duration.
The ignitor lacks this snubber (at least as far as I can see) .

My problem is that I am messing with alluminum welding of the tank, and heavily loaded on that learning curve, so have little time to investigate this matter also.

Lots to learn about ignition systems, but we all deserve an igniter with at least a configurable advance curve, and hopefully also tied to the position of the carburettor.
Fun stuff!
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DragBikeMike
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Re: Rev Limiter
Reply #16 - 06/14/25 at 22:21:01
 
Axman88,

"I've been looking for a factory stock LS650 dyno curve, just for purposes of self-education, but not finding anything published.  Can you point me to a curve posted here on the forum, or elsewhere?  Some accounts made it sound like you could play pool on the surface of the torque curve, ... until it drops off.  Very curious!"

The first thing I did when I got my LS was to put it on the dyno.  I wanted a baseline for my project.  It produced HP very close to factory specs.  Max HP about 5200 rpm, max torque about 3500 rpm.






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DragBikeMike
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Re: Rev Limiter
Reply #17 - 06/14/25 at 22:36:38
 
About 18 months after the baseline dyno, I did another pull.  The engine was modified quite a bit.  Still stock displacement, but I had increased compression, installed a DR650 cam, did some head work, had a much larger carburetor, and had modified the stock muffler.  Now max power was achieved at 6600 rpm, and max torque was at 5050 rpm.

But the engine didn't sign off at 6600, you could pull way past 6600.  In the first two gears, it was very easy to bury the tach.  Currently, with an even more aggressive cylinder head and a vastly improved exhaust system, the thing can easily get out of hand real quick.  These engines don't just fall on their face after max power.  It just keeps pulling.  The rate of acceleration falls off, but it would be very easy to hurt it if you don't pay attention.

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Axman88
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Re: Rev Limiter
Reply #18 - Yesterday at 21:15:38
 
DragBikeMike wrote on 06/14/25 at 22:21:01:
The first thing I did when I got my LS was to put it on the dyno.  I wanted a baseline for my project.  It produced HP very close to factory specs.  Max HP about 5200 rpm, max torque about 3500 rpm.

Thanks for sharing the dyno curves.  The torque curve on the stock engine is impressively wide and flat.  It seems that Suzuki didn't over-rate the power at the crank nearly as much as is common.  I often see rear wheel dyno charts where 20% or more seems to have been eaten up by the transmission and drive train.  Indeed the Suzuki has lower 0-60, and 1/4 mile times than either the Honda VT600 or the Yamaha VStar 650, both of which are rated at closer to 40hp.

Sounds like you've created a real monster with with your LS650.  33% more power is a remarkable increase.   Would a simple aftermarket rev limiter be suitable for protecting your investment?
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-8732
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ThumperPaul
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Re: Rev Limiter
Reply #19 - Today at 05:56:20
 
Mike, you must be really glad Suzuki left you a lot of room to play under the 10k rev limiter!  It would have been a sad day if they had shut you down at 6.5k.  I love your hotrod, Mike and all you share!

I brought this topic up, because I’m in early conversations with a manufacturer in China about making a few things - a TCI for the LS650 is on the list.  The new OEM ones are ridiculously expensive.  

Interesting find on the external standalone rev limiter.  I didn’t even know such a thing existed.  That would be a nice feature to have built into the TCI.

What other enhancements would be nice to have?  Adjustable timing?  The advantages and benefits of a TCI vs CDI make a CDI seem primitive.

I hate anything electrical, so all of this is way above my pay grade!
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